I Am Absolutely Convinced That.........

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NeedhelpinPA.

LoanSafe Member
Feb 14, 2013
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After reading and researching foreclosures and bank fraud and courts and judges and mortgage company servicers and laws.....THEY DO NOT WANT THE HOMEOWNER TO SUCCEED and KEEP THEIR HOMES!

The run around and lying and scheming from EVERYONE regarding this botched real estate mess is making me think I/we don't have a chance against these people, (BANKS, WALL STREET, GOVERNMENT and LEGISLATORS). MY FREAKIN HEAD HURTS! They want the homeowner to GIVE UP so they can get a FREE HOUSE!

WTH???????

The dishonesty is nauseating!!!!!!!!!!!! How can these people sleep at nite?
 

Moe Bedard

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I agree, but it is not so sinister as you think. We live in a country that is ran by the rule of law and NOT by the rule of what is right or help thy neighbor. In fact it is screw thy neighbor as long as it is within the rule of law. In addition, we live in a country where the corporations only duties if they operate within the law is to their shareholders and profits.

Homeowners who break their legally binding contracts are in violation of the law and have to pay for their violations. Giving a homeowner a loan modification or short sale is not good for their shareholders and profits.

Hence, this is WTH is wrong and has been since day one of this mortgage crisis.
 

Royal Delta

LoanSafe Member
Sep 25, 2013
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Moe, I very respectfully disagree with you. Back in the day - maybe 20 or 30 years ago, this was the case. But with securitization and MERS today, many of these banks have gotten free houses - houses that they never paid a penny for - and millions of people have been fraudulently foreclosed upon. Case in point: Ginnae Mae halting the transfer of mortgage servicing right from BoA because BoA doesn't have recorded mortgages and titles: http://www.nationalmortgagenews.com/news/servicing/ginnie-mae-nixes-bank-of-america-mortgage-servicing-transfer-1041601-1.html

I think today there's a lot more to this story ...
 

fparkin

LoanSafe Member
Mar 20, 2010
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I agree with royal delta for every forclosed house bank make money on it one way or other from interest paid buy owner or just selling it
 

Moe Bedard

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Moe, I very respectfully disagree with you. Back in the day - maybe 20 or 30 years ago, this was the case. But with securitization and MERS today, many of these banks have gotten free houses - houses that they never paid a penny for - and millions of people have been fraudulently foreclosed upon. Case in point: Ginnae Mae halting the transfer of mortgage servicing right from BoA because BoA doesn't have recorded mortgages and titles: http://www.nationalmortgagenews.com/news/servicing/ginnie-mae-nixes-bank-of-america-mortgage-servicing-transfer-1041601-1.html

I think today there's a lot more to this story ...
I understand what you are saying and I also agree that there is a lot more to the story. This is just a different facet of how the system works and some government sponsored agencies etc can operate outside the law with immunity.

Yes, I'm well aware of fraudulent mortgages, foreclosures, missing mortgage notes, MERS, bank bailouts and bank shadow inventory etc etc.. After seeing this happen with my own eyes for 7 years, only an idiot would think that something fishy wasn't going on here. This now delves into the conspiracy realm and if anyone knows me, I have no problem diving head first.

My theory on this housing crisis, and the markets is as it has been for many years. This is the systematic destruction and liquidation of the middle class and Main Street America. The reason is because we now live in a New World Order that is global. The old American way simply does not fit into this agenda. A global economy that most the middle class and Main Street America does not want. This is how you make Main Street to go along with the plan is that you break them, take their jobs and houses and force them to keep quiet by the simple fact they will be too busy trying to find work, live and battle day to day that they simply cannot stand up and fight.

You know, just like no one has done much of anything after being abused or fraudulently foreclosed on other than complain on the internet...

An agenda that is called Agenda 21 by the United Nations which has the future of the US already mapped out. You just do not have these maps on your GPS's and Fox News or CNN didn't announce the plan.

You see all the red on this map? This is where no houses or people can live and I would guesstimate that they have a lot of work to do to move people to where they want them to be.

 

Moe Bedard

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More information on Agenda 21;

Agenda 21 is a non-binding, voluntarily implemented action plan of the United Nationswith regard to sustainable development.[1] It is a product of the UN Conference on Environment and Development (UNCED) held in Rio de Janeiro, Brazil, in 1992. It is an action agenda for the UN, other multilateral organizations, and individual governments around the world that can be executed at local, national, and global levels. The "21" in Agenda 21 refers to the 21st Century. It has been affirmed and modified at subsequent UN conferences.

The UN Department of Economic and Social Affairs' Division for Sustainable Development monitors and evaluates progress, nation by nation, towards the adoption of Agenda 21, and makes these reports available to the public on its website.[8]

Australia, for example, is a signatory to Agenda 21 and 88 of its municipalities subscribe to ICLEI, an organization that promotes Agenda 21 globally. Australia's membership is second only to that of the United States.[9] Opposition to Agenda 21 in Australia is not covered in the major media outlets. European countries generally possess well documented Agenda 21 statuses. France, whose national government, along with 14 cities, is a signatory, boasts nationwide programs supporting Agenda 21. The French activist group Nouvelle Force announced in March 2012 that they viewed Agenda 21 as a "sham".[10]

In Africa, national support for Agenda 21 is strong and most countries are signatories. But support is often closely tied to environmental challenges specific to each country; for example, in 2002 Sam Nujoma, who was then President of Namibia, spoke about the importance of adhering to Agenda 21 at the 2002 Earth Summit, noting that as a semi-arid country, Namibia sets a lot of store in theUnited Nations Convention to Combat Desertification (UNCCD).[11] Furthermore, there is little mention of Agenda 21 at the local level in indigenous media. Only major municipalities in sub-Saharan African countries are members of ICLEI. Agenda 21 participation inNorth African countries mirrors that of Middle Eastern countries, with most countries being signatories but little to no adoption on the local-government level. Countries in sub-Saharan Africa and North Africa generally have poorly documented Agenda 21 status reports.[citation needed] By contrast, South Africa's participation in Agenda 21 mirrors that of modern Europe, with 21 city members of ICLEI and support of Agenda 21 by national-level government.[citation needed]

Specific countries[edit]
This section requiresexpansion. (April 2014)
United States[edit]
The national focal point in the United States is the Division Chief for Sustainable Development and Multilateral Affairs, Office of Environmental Policy, Bureau of Oceans and International Environmental and Scientific Affairs, U.S. Department of State.[12]

Support[edit]
The United States is a signatory country to Agenda 21, but because Agenda 21 is a legally non-binding statement of intent and not a treaty, the United States Senate was not required to hold a formal debate or vote on it. It is therefore not considered to be law underArticle Six of the United States Constitution. President George Bush was one of the 178 heads of government who signed the final text of the agreement at the Earth Summit in 1992,[13][14] and in the same year Representatives Nancy Pelosi, Eliot Engel and William Broomfield spoke in support of United States House of Representatives Concurrent Resolution 353, supporting implementation of Agenda 21 in the United States.[15][16]

In the United States, over 528 cities are members of ICLEI, an international sustainability organization that helps to implement the Agenda 21 and Local Agenda 21 concepts across the world. The United States has nearly half of the ICLEI's global membership of 1,200 cities promoting sustainable development at a local level.[9] The United States also has one of the most comprehensively documented Agenda 21 status reports.[17] In response to the opposition, Don Knapp, U.S. spokesman for the ICLEI, has said "Sustainable development is not a top-down conspiracy from the U.N., but a bottom-up push from local governments".[16]

The Arizona Chamber of Commerce and Industry successfully lobbied against an anti-sustainable development bill in 2012, arguing "It would be bad for business" as it could drive away corporations that have embraced sustainable development.

SOURCE: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agenda_21
 

Moe Bedard

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I agree with royal delta for every forclosed house bank make money on it one way or other from interest paid buy owner or just selling it
I hear what you are saying, but money is made of paper and has no intrinsic value. The banks operate under the Federal Reserve which is not Federal or a government agency. They answer only to secret shareholders and they own the printing presses that prints our money plus they tell us how much it is worth.

Hence, they don't really care about making more money, but managing the population and their agenda through the manipulation of our currency. A manipulation that includes our money, jobs and real estate.

The banks are just an arm of this control that we the people voluntarily submit to or make contracts with because without a job, money or a home, we are screwed. Hence, they have this Monopoly game sewn up every which way you look.
 
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kraftykrab

LoanSafe Member
Jan 27, 2014
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Moe,

while I understand your thoughts about corporate priorities, I submit that there's one difference between your description and my observations based upon dealing with my own situation recently. You said that as long as it is within the law, the corporations will do it for the benefit of their shareholders. The problem today, especially in the mortgage industry, is that more often than not the law gets thrown right out the window in favor of $$$$$
 

Moe Bedard

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Moe,

while I understand your thoughts about corporate priorities, I submit that there's one difference between your description and my observations based upon dealing with my own situation recently. You said that as long as it is within the law, the corporations will do it for the benefit of their shareholders. The problem today, especially in the mortgage industry, is that more often than not the law gets thrown right out the window in favor of $$$$$
OK kraftykrab, let me please rephrase that comment; "as long as they can get away with it and breaking the law is not so obvious, the corporations will do it for the benefit of their shareholders."

If you saw my most recent posts above, it shows my complete theory on banking and real estate shenanigans...
 

Royal Delta

LoanSafe Member
Sep 25, 2013
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Well that's scary...I really hope that it's just a bunch of greedy people wanting to get rich quick, and not this... Or rather, it's just an entrenched elite like Timothy Geithner protecting the interests of the big banks, which is what I tend to think.
 

Moe Bedard

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Yeah, so they have more money to go surfing ;)



I'm set on Agenda 21 because it is a world wide agenda in which the US is a major player to make sure that they are a world leader in this New World Order project. How else do you make sure it happens?

1. Drop a bomb on a some cities and move the people that way?

2. Set fires to most the US and move people that way?mmmm.......

or

3. Manipulate the markets, money, economies, laws and real estate to move people so covertly that don't even know what happened?

 

Jeffrey L. Shurtliff

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Dec 4, 2010
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Personally I have brought RULE OF LAW in the court. When it comes to banks and creditors Rule of Law takes a back seat. IT is Liberty and Justice for Some. Super Citizens have more rights. This is not the America I grew up in.
 
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kraftykrab

LoanSafe Member
Jan 27, 2014
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So, where should someone begin if they are in these situations?

I know that rule of law takes a back seat to the deep pockets getting deeper in so many cases. What's the answer for those of us that are in this fight? There's got to be something that can turn the tide. Even foreclosure defense attorneys in my area only want to talk about "file BK, its what we do to fight this". I know that BK serves the purpose, but this is not a one-size-fits-all problem. There's GOT to be some kind of answer to this....
 

Jeffrey L. Shurtliff

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Dec 4, 2010
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There is no answer at this time. The only one I can think of is this is a Federal Government cover up. They use National Associations (contractors) in a legally established quasi way to do what they want. This is a Federal level problem. Politicians will not tackle this problem. I have a suit against the Office of the Comptroller showing clearly they have violated Federal law by not assuring that Wells Fargo has complied with Utah Foreclosure laws. However I am pro se and no judge is going to find for a pro se individual in the Good ole boy club. It does not matter even if I show a Rule of Law has been violated. I need help with this one. I have given this suit to a vice president of a small bank that I deal with. They are constantly being slammed by the OCC. I told them the OCC is not the problem it is Wells Fargo as they are a deputy for the OCC and are giving the bank problems so they will close. Wells Fargo is mad as they are taking their customers and are doing something about it.
 
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Moe Bedard

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The reason BK is an effective tool for lawyers is because it is backed by Federal Law and a system in place to address debtors who have went bankrupt. Currently, there are no Federal Laws or a system designed to help homeowners with mortgage issues. The laws in place for foreclosure defense have little to no teeth. Hence, in most cases, it is a waste of time and money for anyone try to defend a foreclosure action.

What we can do is educate ourselves in order to pick and choose our battles, livelihoods and destinies. This is the answer and sometimes in battles like this it is better to understand who will win 99.9% of the time and plan accordingly based on these statistics.

Even though I may be critical and cynical of our system at times, we still live in disneyland compared to most other countries in the world. What I mean by this is that you can gain knowledge about how this all works like I'm stating in this thread or you can falsely convince yourself that there must be another way to fight or defend a foreclosure when in fact the only way is how we are mostly doing it in this forum. This is done through loan workouts with your mortgage servicers via a loan modification, short sale, deed in lieu or by simply walking away. The only other true legal option is bankruptcy.
 

Royal Delta

LoanSafe Member
Sep 25, 2013
117
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What I've heard is that bankruptcy court requires a higher standard for a creditor to prove that you owe the debt. In county court, the foreclosure mill attorney just shows the judge something that's just probably a print-out of a scan of your note that they got from the MERS database, and it's over.

I think it will change when the average American not affected by this starts to care, and thinks it could happen to themselves or their family. More people are probably more afraid of terrorists crashing a plane into their building than getting foreclosed on in a modification - even though the former is 1 in a trillion, and the latter is highly probable.
 
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jhn_plsn

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Apr 29, 2008
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The BK district I am in now insists that there be a response in order to ensure the lender is aware of the BK and will follow the order. I am in the middle of stripping a heloc in my bk13 and BofA failed to respond to the original filing so now it will cost me a couple grand to serve them again. It is BS as they had the chance and I did my part.
 
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Jeffrey L. Shurtliff

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Dec 4, 2010
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Moe you are correct! And Bankruptcy is only a temporary action against a foreclosure. After mine was discharged the bank promptly foreclosed on me using bogus documents. It did not matter what kind of bogus docs they were as the court was only concerned with the DEFAULT. This is central to all foreclosures.
 
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Moe Bedard

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What I've heard is that bankruptcy court requires a higher standard for a creditor to prove that you owe the debt. In county court, the foreclosure mill attorney just shows the judge something that's just probably a print-out of a scan of your note that they got from the MERS database, and it's over.

I think it will change when the average American not affected by this starts to care, and thinks it could happen to themselves or their family. More people are probably more afraid of terrorists crashing a plane into their building than getting foreclosed on in a modification - even though the former is 1 in a trillion, and the latter is highly probable.
99.9999% of people (regardless of country or race) could care less about anything much more than what deals with their own lives, and or families. We live in a selfish world and our banks and governments have to be just as ruthless as the most viscous citizens in order to properly govern the sheep. They know this and this is how they manage we the people who are very predictable creatures.

I'd say more people are afraid to look in the mirror at their own faults and dark soul then they are of a terrorist or foreclosure. Hence, the reason why our country and world is slowly being destroyed one family at a time and millions of houses per year.

We did it ourselves by not knowing the game or which pill to take in the Matrix.