Are you 60 or older

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maryseas

LoanSafe Member
Aug 2, 2010
48
1
6
Yeah, I'm 60 and I do believe there is some discrimination in this process that the banks are using to delay modifications. The idea is to discourage as many as possible and the result is that the weakest are the ones to drop off the table and lose their homes. Read the class action lawsuit against BAC by the homeowners of Washington State. It pretty well says it all. If you are in ill health, or in any way weaker than the average person through age, health, or disability, you can kiss this process (and your home) good bye. There needs to be a fair housing complaint, and lawsuit. I'm certainly going to complain.
 

bewilderedone

LoanSafe Member
Jul 21, 2009
5
0
1
My husband is 73 I am 63. Got approved for a mod a year ago, although the payment is 43% of income as opposed to the 31% HAMP is supposed to be! I never had an escrow account as I always preferred to pay my own taxes and insurances. I found it easier to pay quarterly and keep my mortgage payments lower. Bottom line is by the time they added escrow back into my account, I am saving on 64 dollars a month. Not too much of a help. Took my a while to realize that total PITI was supposed to be at 31% not just principal. I called the mortgage company and they said it is what it is.......too bad so sad. Still trying to figure out what to do about this.
Maybe this will be helpful to some.....the mortgage company originally denied my mod. I got in touch with Money Market International through MYFICO website, and a counselor called me. Went over all my figures. She got in touch with the mortage people, and the next day I got a phone call from mortgage company telling me I was approved and I could go online and download the paperwork to fill out and send back along with my hardship letter. This was in July, and by Sept. my trial payments began. Got permanent mod December.
 

simpson123

LoanSafe Member
Dec 23, 2010
2
0
0
The most people getting over 60, generally frauded by the person(Rocord's says).
i'm also tells you a story like these fraudulent cases.
Matt Norkett,Matthew Norkett is a banker that cheated a lot of people out of a lot of money so I want to help push the information about him to the top of the search engines so others are not cheated by him in the future.
Hope all were already taken needed steps to aware to them.
Thanks and regards,
Simpson.

 

BabyBlue

LoanSafe Member
Nov 23, 2010
149
1
0
California
maryseas, This is something I had not thought of but I still do not understand why they would discriminate against older people assuming that foreclosure is something banks generally want to avoid. Please let us know about your fair housing complaint. I am 62 (going on 45) so very interested in the logic and the process. Please keep us updated about your encounters with Fair Housing and good luck to you.
 

skeptik

LoanSafe Member
Aug 9, 2010
83
1
0
so cal
It is not surprising that a majority of borrowers in jeopardy are 60+ because they are the more likely group to be forced out of their jobs in this economy and the loss of employment is the primary reason for missing mortgage payments.
 

BabyBlue

LoanSafe Member
Nov 23, 2010
149
1
0
California
Dear Skeptik, True regarding elders (Now that I seem to be one I prefer the word "elders" to less attractive alternatives :-} ), however I am guessing that many elders have, as I do, retirement, social security and other permanent and secure sources of income (The three legged stool concept). This kind of income may be relatively safe...one cannot be fired from social security...at least not yet.

Nevertheless, I must agree at this point in my research of this horror that "big banking" does not care about consistent income. So what remains may be the issue of possible discrimination against this population.

Let us remember that many in this group cannot go get a job and start over. They need and deserve our support. Let us not blame the previous generation (As I did). We are all in some way responsible for the economic problems.

This morning on NBC it was said that housing is going to drop again in value profoundly this year..was it 30%? It is not over, recovery is not a word I would use at this point and I suspect its extensive use now in the media is a deceitful effort to alter the mood of the public and create a sort of distorted jump start in that way. That kind of dishonest thinking seems desperate and inappropriate. It is too early to make such confident statements.

We must remember we are dealing with a global economy now...for the first time and it is far more complex and convoluted...I wonder how many economists really understand the mechanics of what is happening. If they saw a dire picture of the coming years would they tell us? Most, I think, would not.

We are really on our own. We do have some resources and must educate ourselves and utilize them. The expression "when the going gets tough the tough go shopping" no longer works in this climate (nor is it funny)...the only shopping we should be doing is for vehicles that will safely grow whatever money we have.

Those of you who are far from this elder age group should think very carefully about spending and remember that you cannot know the variables that will exist when you reach that age. You may face the same fate at some point despite your best efforts to avoid it (It can't happen to me, you say?). Every dollar you spend is lost. Every dollar you save and invest wisely will theoretically grow. Some things bear repeating. Learn from this.

Those of us in this age group must try to shine a light on any real and defendable allegations of discrimination, perhaps through AARP and Senators and Congressmen who are not getting kickbacks.

Greed and Fraud are rampant and seem to feed off of eachother and grow...spreading like a virus.

I once knew someone who said that there are users and those who get used (nice world view, eh?) and he went on to say he wasn't going to be used. He lived his life swindling hundreds of people out of their life savings. You can see his life etched in his face. It is a terrible face. There are those who choose that path in order to "survive" but it is a Faustian bargain and one they cannot ultimately win. The larger question may be how we define survival.

Anyone who wants to work with me on the possible discrimination of elderly please post an email so we can determine if we can put some meaningful effort together.

Happy New Year...May 2011 begin an era when the people see justice begin to unfold.
 

skeptik

LoanSafe Member
Aug 9, 2010
83
1
0
so cal
B2- I do think that the "elder" boomers may be getting a raw deal as those who are facing loss of their homes at this age are not as likely to recover or be able to start over once and/ or if the economy rebounds and there are jobs to be had. The jobs are going to younger cheaper folk they can mold into their corporate image, e t c. . . AARP is a lobbying group but not as powerful since the young and hispanic voters are more likely to get the attention of the politicos for 2012. The boomers are a disposable nuisance who are going to be even more so as they turn 65 and start drawing social security. The fit is about to hit the shan.

I agree we are on our own and should not rely on the traditional media for the straight scoop on our economic outlook and/or prospects.

Dear Skeptik, True regarding elders (Now that I seem to be one I prefer the word "elders" to less attractive alternatives :-} ), however I am guessing that many elders have, as I do, retirement, social security and other permanent and secure sources of income (The three legged stool concept). This kind of income may be relatively safe...one cannot be fired from social security...at least not yet.

Nevertheless, I must agree at this point in my research of this horror that "big banking" does not care about consistent income. So what remains may be the issue of possible discrimination against this population.

Let us remember that many in this group cannot go get a job and start over. They need and deserve our support. Let us not blame the previous generation (As I did). We are all in some way responsible for the economic problems.

This morning on NBC it was said that housing is going to drop again in value profoundly this year..was it 30%? It is not over, recovery is not a word I would use at this point and I suspect its extensive use now in the media is a deceitful effort to alter the mood of the public and create a sort of distorted jump start in that way. That kind of dishonest thinking seems desperate and inappropriate. It is too early to make such confident statements.

We must remember we are dealing with a global economy now...for the first time and it is far more complex and convoluted...I wonder how many economists really understand the mechanics of what is happening. If they saw a dire picture of the coming years would they tell us? Most, I think, would not.

We are really on our own. We do have some resources and must educate ourselves and utilize them. The expression "when the going gets tough the tough go shopping" no longer works in this climate (nor is it funny)...the only shopping we should be doing is for vehicles that will safely grow whatever money we have.

Those of you who are far from this elder age group should think very carefully about spending and remember that you cannot know the variables that will exist when you reach that age. You may face the same fate at some point despite your best efforts to avoid it (It can't happen to me, you say?). Every dollar you spend is lost. Every dollar you save and invest wisely will theoretically grow. Some things bear repeating. Learn from this.

Those of us in this age group must try to shine a light on any real and defendable allegations of discrimination, perhaps through AARP and Senators and Congressmen who are not getting kickbacks.

Greed and Fraud are rampant and seem to feed off of eachother and grow...spreading like a virus.

I once knew someone who said that there are users and those who get used (nice world view, eh?) and he went on to say he wasn't going to be used. He lived his life swindling hundreds of people out of their life savings. You can see his life etched in his face. It is a terrible face. There are those who choose that path in order to "survive" but it is a Faustian bargain and one they cannot ultimately win. The larger question may be how we define survival.

Anyone who wants to work with me on the possible discrimination of elderly please post an email so we can determine if we can put some meaningful effort together.

Happy New Year...May 2011 begin an era when the people see justice begin to unfold.
 

injeopardy2

LoanSafe Member
Jan 2, 2011
8
0
0
San Bernardino
I was also denied a MOD under HAMP, and then told I wld be considered for a Traditional Mod. So far I have only been offered short sale and/or deed in lieu of foreclosure. yet when I call BoA, I am told a MOD is still under review, to keep making my reg Monthly payment. It has been 1yr 5mos since I applied for MOD. Meanwhile, payments fell behind and I have no viable means to catch up. I am 61yrs and had the home for 11yrs. It seems as if the intent of the Bank is to just force you to give up your home voluntarilly, rather than help.
 

BabyBlue

LoanSafe Member
Nov 23, 2010
149
1
0
California
Dear injeopardy2,

My guess is that they told you to continue to making your payments because they want to **** as much money out of you as they can before they go in for the kill to put it bluntly.

I have concluded that they are ruthless, they do not care about you, about your credibility, your integrity, your circumstances, your family, or anything else but money.

I would advise you, based on my experience (as it continues to unfold or should I say unravel) that you should not believe anything they say, because they are manipulative, engage in unethical, criminal behavior and have a premeditated plan to take your house. Nothing you say means anything to them unless you can provide proof that their activity is inappropriate and put a stop to it. The best way to do that is through an attorney. I would recommend only going to a law firm that has a long history of consumer protection defense. The servicer/lender is pretty sure you cannot afford an attorney. These cases are expensive to undertake (so they tell me). It is my understanding that attorneys are increasingly unwilling to take them on a contingency basis because even the FRACKING Federal Government is screwing us. Others may disagree with me and I speak only from personal experience and limited research.

I have found strength from the company of others on these forums and I hope you do also. Knowing you are not alone and others feel your pain and more importantly know what you are going through will hopefully help in some way. Do what you can. That is all you can do. But do not sit and wait for the sky to fall. Take whatever action you can, arm yourself with whatever knowledge you can. This is the advice others have given me and it has helped. When you do something you feel better.
 

1ofthemany

LoanSafe Member
Jun 29, 2010
1
0
0
Hello BabyBlue, sound good but not sure there is time, it all takes so much time. I am soon to be 61 and am fighting to keep my home for my- self, child and grandchildren. Got what was descirbed as a inhouse mod, interest reduction on first, dropped mthly pmt about 100. have been setting back on 2 BofA, 2nd HELOC. Seems there are a lot of problems on both loans, will not go into details but hard to find a lawyer with NO money. It is shameful, very shameful what our country is doing to us. Very great of you to reach out to people. Good luck with our venture, I will be watching as I can.
 

injeopardy2

LoanSafe Member
Jan 2, 2011
8
0
0
San Bernardino
Yeah, I have thought about this as well. I am 61yrs - approaching retirement which I feel as if the Banks are less enthusiatic to help us; it would be too easy. I had not expected the Market to crash and leave me without any equity in my home- and so I was planning my retirement to include keeping my home. My Job pension +SSI -would have allowed me to do this. absent a Modification to reduce my Mortgage payment, would put a strain on my fixed income. I would hate to live out my Senior years, not knowing how long I would be able to keep paying this very high payment I currently have. I have two friends who are in the same age group, tht have gotten a MOD, but it is a 5yr MOD only, which means they may face problems in the future, unless they get a permanent MOD to include a restructure -allowing them to keep their home with an affordable payment. I do feel as if our age is factor in the Banks dragging their feet to help. Thanks for your point of view. I am still employed, and can't really plan my retirement exit date. all plans have been squashed as of 2008 to present. I Pray and pray some more. nothing else has been effective. I have consulted with an Attorney, for a possible Loan Audit, but there is no guarantee of its results. I am using every avenue I can, and I don't mind making calls, sending emails, letters, visits, attending Mortgage help forums - in person and/or networks organizations in search of help. I am tired of the stress and lost of sleep though.
 

BabyBlue

LoanSafe Member
Nov 23, 2010
149
1
0
California
I couldn't sleep either, of course, but I started taking sleeping pills that my doctor takes and the only ones I feel comfortable taking...some variation on "Simply Sleep" and often your drug store will have their own brand but make sure it has same ingredients. That and a warm mug of milk and a good book. My doctor also gave me a prescription for tranquilizers which I take every morning. That too, helps.

I just signed up for a large storage unit and reserved a rental truck for next week. I feel so detatched from my life. I will begin by emptying the garage (then I can get my car in!). I need to be prepared for whatever comes to pass.

I have been looking for houses for lease and found that Tucson and Santa Fe, NM are real possibilities so that also helps one sleep. Do "if/then" scenarios in a notebook with research notes. It will help you feel less bad.

I sent attorney my infamous loan docs yesterday and emailed him scanned in copy of the equally infamous Intent to Foreclose letter at his request. I will keep you all posted.

I have searched for an attorney for a long time and finally found someone who can help me...or so it seems. We'll see what he says post doc review.

Keep trying to find an attorney. Even try Legal Aid, or the local Senior Center...you do not need to be old-old...I think if you are 50...they have attorneys who volunteer for a free hour of counsel and you can sign up for that. At least it is something.

I think you also have the right to file an action yourself, that may depend on the state. If all else fails that is what I am going to do if I am allowed to.

All of these things will help you sleep.
 

Moving On

LoanSafe Member
Jul 15, 2010
38
0
0
Indiana
We are 63 and 70. We've been trying to work with the mortgage servicer for nearly three years. They have never offered a modification at 31% of our gross income including through the office of the pres at Wells Fargo. On the HAMP they offered they grossed up SS retirement income adding $425 to the total then calculated 31% - all "legal" as per attorneys. It was also the 5 year mod so it was not sustainable. Perhaps time to tell our stories to AARP?
 

GAOinLV

LoanSafe Member
Mar 25, 2010
38
1
8
I am 60. The condo that I purchased in Nevada was my "retirement" condo. We used part of our VERY limited savings to put a down payment on the condo, and then the value of the condo promptly dropped by 25% (within months of our purchase). It is now valued at less than 40% of purchase price and at less than 50% of amount owed. It was when I figured out that I would still be upside down when I died that I decided to walk. Unfortunate, since my main reason for buying a condo was to have something to leave my kids. At least I won't be leaving them with an upsidedown mortgage to deal with....
 

ISeekPeace

LoanSafe Member
May 12, 2010
11
0
0
My mom is 85 years old. I have been trying to get a modification for her since 2007. She got an in-house modification from Bank of America in June that was way out of her reach to pay. She also got a forbearance offer that was $2,000/month more than her total gross income, before any minimal living expenses. I'm trying to get a new modification, but was told tonight that I have 24-48 hours before the lender starts foreclosure proceedings. I am so tired. I don't know what to do, and we have no savings or anything else to pay for assistance. I am so sad. So tired. So out of ideas to keep fighting this. Any suggestions?
 

Cat Damiano

Mortgage Wars
Sep 10, 2007
10,541
39
48
Colorado
www.loansafe.org

Moving On

LoanSafe Member
Jul 15, 2010
38
0
0
Indiana
Some suggestions

ISeekPeace,

It's likely that you've tried some of these things but I hope something will be new. I talked with a HUD approved housing counselor. The one I talked with took financial information, helped us clarify what we wanted, and made conference calls to the bank with us. Of the "advocates" I've tried, that agency seemed most supportive. They would also have information on reverse mortgage if that would be an option for your mom. The government website listing HUD approved counselors is: U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD)

You might try calling AARP. They were not helping individual homeowners but may be able to link you to local or state resources. Local state AARP offices can be found via: AARP in Your State ? Find Local AARP Offices, News, Programs & Events for Boomers & Seniors

When I was wronged by the bank I sought other advocates to help. What I found was that those requests only resulted in new requests for documents and review for programs, all unaffordable, rather than reviewing what had been done already. In your Mom's case they might be more helpful. I'd probably recommend contacting your U.S. Senator's first. I think most have staff assigned to foreclosure and housing issues so you can begin with a call. Your U.S. Representative or state legislators are also options.

Go with the above three possibilities first. After that you can try the following.

If the mortgage is backed by Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac they have Resource Centers to handle inquiries. (Let me know if you need help finding phone numbers for those.)

You can file a complaint with your state attorney general (takes work to fill out the complaint form so it's not quite as easy as simply making a call). You could start with a call though as they might refer you to good resources.

Also on the HUD website under "avoiding foreclosure", Avoiding Foreclosure/U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development (HUD), they have links to an "Emergency Homeowners Loan Program", "Talk to a foreclosure avoidance counselor. The HOPE NOW phone hotline is 1-888-995-4673. This government program might be ending this month. I didn't find it especially effective but it's worth a try if other things don't work.

In my experience our bank began foreclosure and has kept that process going while we worked to get a short sale. That is, there were two processes going at once. I would hope you can continue to work on getting a modification even though that foreclosure process is going on. From what I've been hearing it does take quite a while for the bank to foreclose but getting that notice delivered or getting the paperwork in the mail was awful! We did hire an attorney and she was able to stall the foreclosure process while we worked to find a buyer. If you could find free legal aid that may buy you some time.

I hope I haven't overwhelmed you with information. Part of the stress process is difficulty making decisions and trouble concentrating so don't forget to breathe and take breaks from the effort as you're able. As I noted, you have probably tried some or all of these suggestions but I hope there's something useful here for you.

This process is wearing so your tiredness and sadness and being out of ideas is normal for the experience. We release stress chemicals in three ways: sweating, crying, and laughing. I think the sweating means aerobic exercise (which I can't do) rather than this summer's heat dome, but crying and watching comedy should be doable.

I'm with you and your mom in spirit and wish you both moments of peace and beauty amid the storm.
 

ISeekPeace

LoanSafe Member
May 12, 2010
11
0
0
Thank you for the information. It is much appreciated. I've spent the day following up with them. I had three conversations of Bank of America today. The first was simply informative. The second was nasty. The third was with a very kind, supportive rep. All the same, we're in deep, deep trouble here. They were not offering help. Oy.
 

ISeekPeace

LoanSafe Member
May 12, 2010
11
0
0
Thank you so much for the suggestions. I'll be working on these tomorrow. I did have a file with a HUD counselor. He flat out refused to make calls to the lender, to help us with conference calls, or even return calls or emails. I'm almost afraid to try with another! But I've spoken to several knowledgeable individuals today who seem to have the resources to help. I will contact our Congressional and Senate representatives. I'll try the TV and News sources if that will help! I'm just not sure how much time I have from this point. It appears this foreclosure is really underway.