Applying for Mod through B of A and they assign to Wells Fargo and start foreclosure...

tshirtqueen

LoanSafe Member
May 29, 2012
3
2
0
I have been a follower of the forum for some time, and now have the need to ask for your help.

I have been strung along since October of 2009 by B of A on a loan modification. I was paying on time, and they told me to stop paying so they could modify my loan and reduce my interest rate. We modified the loan they merged with Countryside and in a systems update changed my B of A Loan number. 11 months of payments, in full, were never applied to my account. To correct their error B of A said another modification was in order and so in 2010 the modification nightmare began. I continued to pay regular payments, as instructed until May of 2011 and then threw up my hands in disgust.

I reapplied for modification, and purchased a REST report to support my request....went round and round was denied for HAMP "because your investor does not participate" and then was submitted for an in-house. I was told they had everything they needed and we were waiting for an approval.

A week ago I was served with foreclosure...by Wells Fargo. About 6 weeks ago B of A assigned the mortgage to Wells (for who they were servicing, apparently, even though the note is a B of A security). I filed an answer today (through my attorney) who is asking them to produce the note.

I called B of A and they said "not to worry about it" as the foreclosure would not proceed while they were working on a modification. ...How can they modify a loan they assigned to someone else? Now what?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Elle

freedomwon

LoanSafe Member
Oct 30, 2010
2,794
23
38
California
tshirtqueen - Glad to your the forum has been of benefit to you. Without having your documents in front of me, based on your post it sounds like BofA was previously both the servicer & investor on your loan. They most recently re-assigned the servicing to Wells Fargo.

As it stands now, Wells Fargo is your servicer & BofA is the investor.
How can they modify a loan they assigned to someone else?
The servicer (Wells Fargo) needs to seek permission from the investor BofA to modify the loan. So ultimately, BofA has the final word on approving a modification.

BofA (no doubt) is circumventing the system & manipulating their obligation to the terms of the recent settlement agreement since they are no longer the "servicer". Keep this in your arsenal of evidence that they have changed roles. Hopefully your attorney is right on top of this.

In fact, if you haven't done so already, go to your local county recorders office & get a certified copy of the recent assignment. As long as you're there, get copies of all documents that have recorded on your property since inception of your loan. You just may need them further down the road.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Elle

tshirtqueen

LoanSafe Member
May 29, 2012
3
2
0
Thanks for your reply!

I have copies of everything on file at the courthouse. They did not file the Assignment to Wells Fargo...not sure if this is required in Florida. I have a copy of the Assignment only because it came with the foreclosure documents.

Should I contact Wells for a Modification, or just wait to see how they respond to my answer?

Interesting side note...the Promissory note was never filed with the court either, nor did I receive a copy with my closing documents, and I am not sure that I signed one. Two -years ago I requested all the docs from B of A and they didn't have a copy then, however, in the foreclosure filing there is a signed copy of the note...not sure if it is real or fabricated.


tshirtqueen - Glad to your the forum has been of benefit to you. Without having your documents in front of me, based on your post it sounds like BofA was previously both the servicer & investor on your loan. They most recently re-assigned the servicing to Wells Fargo.

As it stands now, Wells Fargo is your servicer & BofA is the investor. The servicer (Wells Fargo) needs to seek permission from the investor BofA to modify the loan. So ultimately, BofA has the final word on approving a modification.

BofA (no doubt) is circumventing the system & manipulating their obligation to the terms of the recent settlement agreement since they are no longer the "servicer". Keep this in your arsenal of evidence that they have changed roles. Hopefully your attorney is right on top of this.

In fact, if you haven't done so already, go to your local county recorders office & get a certified copy of the recent assignment. As long as you're there, get copies of all documents that have recorded on your property since inception of your loan. You just may need them further down the road.
 

freedomwon

LoanSafe Member
Oct 30, 2010
2,794
23
38
California
Should I contact Wells for a Modification, or just wait to see how they respond to my answer?
Yes, I would wait to see how they respond & then you may want to apply for a mod with Wells. Good work on getting all your docs already from the recorders office. I presume you've provided copies to your attorney for some scrutiny. You may need to do a little detective work yourself! So many things are just not right with these docs that get filed. If you haven't done so already, you may want to familiarize yourself with this thread http://www.loansafe.org/forum/unite-fight-share-your-ideas-how-homeowners-can-fight-back-against-fraud/43321-forged-robo-signed-mix-matched-signatures.html You just might discover some familiar names as signors on your docs!
 
  • Like
Reactions: Elle

tshirtqueen

LoanSafe Member
May 29, 2012
3
2
0
Fast forward almost one year later.....

I recently attended court-ordered mediation for this foreclosure. While the foreclosure was filed by Wells Fargo they transferred the servicing to SLS filing a last-minute amendment to the complaint.

Anyway, I came prepared, and very dramatically dropped my seven-inch stack of documents on the mediation table prior to sitting down. I then opened spreadsheets on two computers documenting my account and all written, electronic, and telephone correspondence for the last four years. I was ready for action.

The bank was represented by local council, and a bank rep appeared via phone. They tried to convince me that I could afford a crazy modification. I said "no way" and took them through the real issues of the case:

10 payments were never credited to my account (likely because of a servicing and account number change)
The amount I supposedly owe, as stated in the complaint is wrong, and is a different amount than on their own records (two conflicting amounts)
I showed them a letter I received from Bank of America admitting the payments had not been credited which promised the account would be corrected if I signed a modification. (I showed them the letter, but did not let them take a copy of it)

The local attorney said I was misreading the account statement and made a great show of walking me through it, and teaching me how to read it. She didn't get very far, when she realized that the numbers did not add up, and that payments were shown as being received but the account was not credited. When I asked about the accounting records, they admitted they were wrong, and that the prior servicer (BofA) sent over very little in my file.

I then told them that the bank has know all along about this accounting error, and has repeatedly tried to coerce me into signing a modification to "make it easier" to correct their errors. (I have all of the written correspondence to support this.)

I explained that before I would have ever considered signing a modification agreement, I wanted to establish ownership of the note, and then produced the eight qualified written requests I had sent, and their standard "we'll get it to you in 20 days responses" which of course they never did.

I went on to say that I requested copies of the mortgage and note four times, and the bank only ever could produce a copy of the mortgage, never the note.

I reiterated my skepticism about ownership and refused to discuss modification until the account record could be corrected and that they could produce a copy of the original note. (We had filed a motion to produce the note, and they had previously refused to do so, as well as denying our request to depose the individual who verified the documents required for foreclosure.)

I further informed them that due to a foreclosure on my credit record I had not been hired for two very-highly paid positions in my field and there error had caused damage to my reputation and my career. (Again, I have proof)

They were shell-shocked. Even the mediator was speechless when I was done. We recessed for a few minuted and when we reconvened they asked to continue mediation for 45 days (which is unheard of, apparently) and I agreed.


Since then, my attorney has been to the court clerk to view the documents on file. The mortgage is there and is signed in blue ink. The note is there, and is signed in black ink. The signature looks very much like mine, but there are some differences.

The note is stamped:

"Pay to the Order of __________* without recourse Bank of America NA by Christina M Schmitt. (likely prior to September of 2007, based on Linked-In Employment record of Christina Schmitt. (The * refers to the separate stamp which reads "Wells Fargo Bank NA, as trustee for Bank of America Mortgage Securities")


There are clearly problems with the loan and the accounting. I also question whether the chain of title has been broken, and if the plaintiff listed as Wells Fargo as Trustees for
Banc of America Mortgage Pass though Certificates 2006-B have standing to file suit.



Here are the documents we have:

The
(allegedly original) "note" with Bank of America with an origination date of 8/28/2006 with a "pay to to Wells Fargo"


Mortgage Assignment to Wells Fargo by Bank of America on March 20, 2012 prior to foreclosure.



Wells Fargo filed suit on behalf of the trust, however as the note only shows an endorsement to the trust, how does Bank of America have standing?

I understand that Bank of America serviced the loan for Wells, and then sent it back to them, so how can they file the complaint?

Also, aside from the original endorsement to Wells, the document has no other stamps or writings to indicate a transfer to a MBS.



I am determined to fight this and win it! I would appreciate any insight and suggestions for next steps.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Elle

Elle

LoanSafe Member
Aug 16, 2016
96
16
8
62
I have been a follower of the forum for some time, and now have the need to ask for your help.

I have been strung along since October of 2009 by B of A on a loan modification. I was paying on time, and they told me to stop paying so they could modify my loan and reduce my interest rate. We modified the loan they merged with Countryside and in a systems update changed my B of A Loan number. 11 months of payments, in full, were never applied to my account. To correct their error B of A said another modification was in order and so in 2010 the modification nightmare began. I continued to pay regular payments, as instructed until May of 2011 and then threw up my hands in disgust.

I reapplied for modification, and purchased a REST report to support my request....went round and round was denied for HAMP "because your investor does not participate" and then was submitted for an in-house. I was told they had everything they needed and we were waiting for an approval.

A week ago I was served with foreclosure...by Wells Fargo. About 6 weeks ago B of A assigned the mortgage to Wells (for who they were servicing, apparently, even though the note is a B of A security). I filed an answer today (through my attorney) who is asking them to produce the note.

I have been a follower of the forum for some time, and now have the need to ask for your help.

I have been strung along since October of 2009 by B of A on a loan modification. I was paying on time, and they told me to stop paying so they could modify my loan and reduce my interest rate. We modified the loan they merged with Countryside and in a systems update changed my B of A Loan number. 11 months of payments, in full, were never applied to my account. To correct their error B of A said another modification was in order and so in 2010 the modification nightmare began. I continued to pay regular payments, as instructed until May of 2011 and then threw up my hands in disgust.

I reapplied for modification, and purchased a REST report to support my request....went round and round was denied for HAMP "because your investor does not participate" and then was submitted for an in-house. I was told they had everything they needed and we were waiting for an approval.

A week ago I was served with foreclosure...by Wells Fargo. About 6 weeks ago B of A assigned the mortgage to Wells (for who they were servicing, apparently, even though the note is a B of A security). I filed an answer today (through my attorney) who is asking them to produce the note.

I called B of A and they said "not to worry about it" as the foreclosure would not proceed while they were working on a modification. ...How can they modify a loan they assigned to someone else? Now what?

I called B of A and they said "not to worry about it" as the foreclosure would not proceed while they were working on a modification. ...How can they modify a loan they assigned to someone else? Now what?
 

Elle

LoanSafe Member
Aug 16, 2016
96
16
8
62
Hi tshirt,
Curious how your case ended up. I, too have the same Christina M Schmitt undated-endorsed in blank Note. I was wondering if we could compare her "rubber stamp". Are you still monitoring this site?
Elle
 

Donnah N

LoanSafe Member
Aug 1, 2017
8
1
3
65
Hi tshirt,
Curious how your case ended up. I, too have the same Christina M Schmitt undated-endorsed in blank Note. I was wondering if we could compare her "rubber stamp". Are you still monitoring this site?
Elle
Hi,
I thought this information might be useful to you -
My Note, originated by BoA and sold to FreddieMac in 2007, shows the en blanc stamp without recourse on the top part of my Note. The stamp says "Christina M. Schmitt Assistant Vice President" The en blanc stamping is unsigned, but it has a FAX stamp at the top dated 12/6/2011.
Now, look at the signers at the bottom of this document from the SEC website!
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1382289/000114420407001636/v062347_ex99-11.htm
This is a document between Goldman Sachs, Assignor and GS Mortgage Securities, Corp. as Assignees. Christina M. Schmitt signs for BANA, the Servicer.
NOTE: On this date, Dec. 1, 2006, Schmitt signs for BoA as VICE President, NOT Assistant VP.
There are many more examples in the SEC filings.
---------
In my experience, people do not usually get demoted and stay with the company in those kinds of salaried positions. It's unlikely that some time after Dec. 1, 2006, Schmitt took a demotion and a pay cut for the priviledge of stamping her en blanc endorsement on my Note.
 

Elle

LoanSafe Member
Aug 16, 2016
96
16
8
62
Hi,
I thought this information might be useful to you -
My Note, originated by BoA and sold to FreddieMac in 2007, shows the en blanc stamp without recourse on the top part of my Note. The stamp says "Christina M. Schmitt Assistant Vice President" The en blanc stamping is unsigned, but it has a FAX stamp at the top dated 12/6/2011.
Now, look at the signers at the bottom of this document from the SEC website!
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1382289/000114420407001636/v062347_ex99-11.htm
This is a document between Goldman Sachs, Assignor and GS Mortgage Securities, Corp. as Assignees. Christina M. Schmitt signs for BANA, the Servicer.
NOTE: On this date, Dec. 1, 2006, Schmitt signs for BoA as VICE President, NOT Assistant VP.
There are many more examples in the SEC filings.
---------
In my experience, people do not usually get demoted and stay with the company in those kinds of salaried positions. It's unlikely that some time after Dec. 1, 2006, Schmitt took a demotion and a pay cut for the priviledge of stamping her en blanc endorsement on my Note.
Wow! That is my smoking gun. I have a copy of a note dated in 2007 that was rubber stamped with her as Asst VP. You're right, when does one go from VP in 2006 to Asst. VP in 2007? Very helpful my dear. Very helpful! Thank you so much!
 

Javagold

LoanSafe Member
Mar 2, 2012
144
10
18
I have same blank stamped Christina Schmidt on my note from 2007. I'm willing to discuss, compare, etc if needed. Quite amazing, in a criminal way of course.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Elle

Elle

LoanSafe Member
Aug 16, 2016
96
16
8
62
I have same blank stamped Christina Schmidt on my note from 2007. I'm willing to discuss, compare, etc if needed. Quite amazing, in a criminal way of course.
I think it is Schmitt. However there it is noted as
I have same blank stamped Christina Schmidt on my note from 2007. I'm willing to discuss, compare, etc if needed. Quite amazing, in a criminal way of course.
Hello Javagold,

I actually have note copies with the Christina Schmitt stamped signature that I can upload to you. Don't know if it will help but there is a document on the SEC (that member Donnah N referenced in her post) that shows Schmitt as a Vice President in Dec. 2006. Not Asst. Vice President like the stamped signature says on note copies issued AFTER Dec. 2006. Like Donnah N. says Did she get demoted after 2006? Not likely. Meaning this casts doubt that Schmitt placed her rubber stamp on the note with her own hand--which has to be done in order to authenticate an endorsement. It's fraud. No doubt. Getting a Judge that cares is another thing.
Good Luck and I would like to see your stamped copy!

email me at [email protected]

Elle
 

Javagold

LoanSafe Member
Mar 2, 2012
144
10
18
I think it is Schmitt. However there it is noted as


Hello Javagold,

I actually have note copies with the Christina Schmitt stamped signature that I can upload to you. Don't know if it will help but there is a document on the SEC (that member Donnah N referenced in her post) that shows Schmitt as a Vice President in Dec. 2006. Not Asst. Vice President like the stamped signature says on note copies issued AFTER Dec. 2006. Like Donnah N. says Did she get demoted after 2006? Not likely. Meaning this casts doubt that Schmitt placed her rubber stamp on the note with her own hand--which has to be done in order to authenticate an endorsement. It's fraud. No doubt. Getting a Judge that cares is another thing.
Good Luck and I would like to see your stamped copy!

email me at [email protected]

Elle
 

Elle

LoanSafe Member
Aug 16, 2016
96
16
8
62
Hi,
I thought this information might be useful to you -
My Note, originated by BoA and sold to FreddieMac in 2007, shows the en blanc stamp without recourse on the top part of my Note. The stamp says "Christina M. Schmitt Assistant Vice President" The en blanc stamping is unsigned, but it has a FAX stamp at the top dated 12/6/2011.
Now, look at the signers at the bottom of this document from the SEC website!
https://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/data/1382289/000114420407001636/v062347_ex99-11.htm
This is a document between Goldman Sachs, Assignor and GS Mortgage Securities, Corp. as Assignees. Christina M. Schmitt signs for BANA, the Servicer.
NOTE: On this date, Dec. 1, 2006, Schmitt signs for BoA as VICE President, NOT Assistant VP.
There are many more examples in the SEC filings.
---------
In my experience, people do not usually get demoted and stay with the company in those kinds of salaried positions. It's unlikely that some time after Dec. 1, 2006, Schmitt took a demotion and a pay cut for the priviledge of stamping her en blanc endorsement on my Note.
I've been scouring the SEC. I am looking for a Christina Schmitt signature line as a VP BEFORE Jun 19th 2006. Can you help?
Thanks!
 

Donnah N

LoanSafe Member
Aug 1, 2017
8
1
3
65
Wow! That is my smoking gun. I have a copy of a note dated in 2007 that was rubber stamped with her as Asst VP. You're right, when does one go from VP in 2006 to Asst. VP in 2007? Very helpful my dear. Very helpful! Thank you so much!
Hi Elle, I thought you might find this interesting as well - BoA didn't record my mortgage directly after closing on the loan. Instead, it mysteriously floated around for three days before it got to the registry of deeds to get recorded. I didn't know anything about this. Only after I got started with them in court representing myself pro se did I stumble on this next issue. I don't know what happened to the mortgage I actually signed, but in the space of those 3 days, BoA replaced the mortgage I signed with a forged counterfeit! Yup, they really did that. How do I know it isn't the one I signed? Easy. At the closing they presented me with a mortgage that was missing the escrow waiver page. So I made them go fetch the page and we hand wrote a change onto that page where it mentions any riders attached to it. So, for my real mortgage, there should be a page with handwritten corrections and an extra page for the escrow waiver. Both are missing and many of the initials don't look like my handwriting. The other suspicious thing is that the notary acknowledgement is missing my name entirely. I went to the registry to see what they recorded. Yup, I found the forgery. So it turns out that I have a Note with an illigit Christina M Schmitt on it and no legal mortgage to back it up. This mortgage should be void. So there is no document giving anyone, including Boa any rights to service it or get any money from me. Every lawyer I told about having a counterfeit mortgage just rolls their eyes and dismisses me because they think I'm talking about a robo signature or something similar. I can't find more than a couple cases of actual forged counterfeit mortgages. Someone screwed up. But these guys are such crooks.

During my loan mod application period, a woman named Shelly Gillis took my IRS tax request form and wrote additional stuff on it - AFTER I had signed it! And then she submitted it to the IRS. I may be wrong but altering the IRS form creates a forgery because it changed the intent of what I had signed, and I think that messing with other people's tax forms and sending them to the IRS is a felony! They really are crooks.

Anyway, Re: Christina M Schmitt. I believe she may have worked in the old Countrywide Recon document vault area at one time. I've noticed a few mentions of ReconTrust in the chintzy records BoA was willing to fork over.
There is a really helpful deposition transcript that is enlightening. The depo is for Michelle Sjolander, dated Weds. March 14 2012 in a case styled as 'Countrywide Home Loans Servicing v. redacted, et al. But the case number is 09-21198CA09 and it is an 11th Circuit case in Miami-Dade County ( home terretory of Chrissy Schmitt!

Have fun reading it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Elle

Elle

LoanSafe Member
Aug 16, 2016
96
16
8
62
Hi Elle, I thought you might find this interesting as well - BoA didn't record my mortgage directly after closing on the loan. Instead, it mysteriously floated around for three days before it got to the registry of deeds to get recorded. I didn't know anything about this. Only after I got started with them in court representing myself pro se did I stumble on this next issue. I don't know what happened to the mortgage I actually signed, but in the space of those 3 days, BoA replaced the mortgage I signed with a forged counterfeit! Yup, they really did that. How do I know it isn't the one I signed? Easy. At the closing they presented me with a mortgage that was missing the escrow waiver page. So I made them go fetch the page and we hand wrote a change onto that page where it mentions any riders attached to it. So, for my real mortgage, there should be a page with handwritten corrections and an extra page for the escrow waiver. Both are missing and many of the initials don't look like my handwriting. The other suspicious thing is that the notary acknowledgement is missing my name entirely. I went to the registry to see what they recorded. Yup, I found the forgery. So it turns out that I have a Note with an illigit Christina M Schmitt on it and no legal mortgage to back it up. This mortgage should be void. So there is no document giving anyone, including Boa any rights to service it or get any money from me. Every lawyer I told about having a counterfeit mortgage just rolls their eyes and dismisses me because they think I'm talking about a robo signature or something similar. I can't find more than a couple cases of actual forged counterfeit mortgages. Someone screwed up. But these guys are such crooks.

During my loan mod application period, a woman named Shelly Gillis took my IRS tax request form and wrote additional stuff on it - AFTER I had signed it! And then she submitted it to the IRS. I may be wrong but altering the IRS form creates a forgery because it changed the intent of what I had signed, and I think that messing with other people's tax forms and sending them to the IRS is a felony! They really are crooks.

Anyway, Re: Christina M Schmitt. I believe she may have worked in the old Countrywide Recon document vault area at one time. I've noticed a few mentions of ReconTrust in the chintzy records BoA was willing to fork over.
There is a really helpful deposition transcript that is enlightening. The depo is for Michelle Sjolander, dated Weds. March 14 2012 in a case styled as 'Countrywide Home Loans Servicing v. redacted, et al. But the case number is 09-21198CA09 and it is an 11th Circuit case in Miami-Dade County ( home terretory of Chrissy Schmitt!

Have fun reading it.
Thanks Donnah! You sent me down the right track with the Schmitt endorsement. Still out here in zombie foreclosure land. The "trust" was denied Summary Judgment against me albeit without prejudice so they will be back. Hired an attorney. Do you mean Re"construct" Trust? LOL. They don't even try to hide it in the name. Shellpoint- Shellgame. Just a joke to them. Great info and keep up the fight!!
 

just_me

LoanSafe Member
Sep 14, 2015
380
27
28
While I have a different fund, it does appear that during the height of the fraud, stamps were created using allegedly stolen identity, using former employees' authority, and attached to notes at much later dates (for use in court). Always an alonge. These recreated notes almost always use black ink for signatures. It's too hard for them to fool you with trying to recreate in blue ink. (originals likely destroyed) They depend on using electronic copies/printouts in black as proof, hence the mismatch from other docs at origination.
 

Donnah N

LoanSafe Member
Aug 1, 2017
8
1
3
65
Thanks Donnah! You sent me down the right track with the Schmitt endorsement. Still out here in zombie foreclosure land. The "trust" was denied Summary Judgment against me albeit without prejudice so they will be back. Hired an attorney. Do you mean Re"construct" Trust? LOL. They don't even try to hide it in the name. Shellpoint- Shellgame. Just a joke to them. Great info and keep up the fight!!
You might also like to know that if the result of your Christina M. Schmitt makes the document a forgery, I think (and I am not any kind of lawyer, so this isn't legal advice) but from what I have found on line, a counterfeit document is null and void from the moment it was created. And if a void document is used as evidence it is considered fraud upon the court. That is considered very, very bad (so long as the judge involved gives a crap) and I read that it may open the door for reconsideration of Summary Judgment decisions, sanctions, dismissal, lawyer fees, punitive damages, etc. I also read that if a notarized document is a forgery and lawyers present it to the court, knowing it is a fraud, the punishments can be more severe. Oh yes, here is another thing I found in several law review articles - forged counterfeit documents are equal to 'nothing' and as a result there is NO statute of limitations on getting it declared a forgery. Apparently, forgery (the adverb, not the noun), as an act, has a statute of limitations as a type of fraud, but that seems to be a different matter. For whatever this info is worth.....
 

Javagold

LoanSafe Member
Mar 2, 2012
144
10
18
I need to figure out the Christina M. Schmitt.
BOA NA , BAC Home Loans And Fannie Mae pieces of the puzzle together.

Bank of America NA also switched my account number while in good standing and tried to say they were the same servicer as BAC Home Loans. But I know they aren’t !!! Plus they switched it back again a year later this time saying by merger !!! .... No assignments of mortgage either ....
So if any one can help me figure it out exactly what the Banksters did , it’s much appreciated!!
 

Donnah N

LoanSafe Member
Aug 1, 2017
8
1
3
65
I need to figure out the Christina M. Schmitt.
BOA NA , BAC Home Loans And Fannie Mae pieces of the puzzle together.

Bank of America NA also switched my account number while in good standing and tried to say they were the same servicer as BAC Home Loans. But I know they aren’t !!! Plus they switched it back again a year later this time saying by merger !!! .... No assignments of mortgage either ....
So if any one can help me figure it out exactly what the Banksters did , it’s much appreciated!!
For what it's worth, I have read that Fannie and Freddie have nine digit loan ID numbers. After BoA originates your loan, they sell it to Fannie/Freddie (the GSA's). When the GSAs get the actual note/mtg. they assign it a 9 digit number and apply that number with a bar code onto the front of the loan and mortgage. I don't believe that ever happened with mine, but I actually have an old mortgage with a different bank that by the time I paid it off did come back to me with the Freddie loan number and bar code right where it was supposed to be. Imagine that!