2nd Mortgage EXTINGUISHED by Citi Mortgage under 2MP Program!

TomEason

LoanSafe Guide
Jun 18, 2009
12,390
85
48
SF Bay Area CA
Hello,

Like everybody else in this thread, I also received a Dodd-Frank Certification from CitiMortgage (2nd mortgage). The letter states:

"As part of your participation in the federal government Home Affordable Modification Program with your first mortgage, your second mortgage may be eligible to be closed. This means that if you qualify, your second mortgage debt will be forgiven. In order for us to to review your eligibility, please fill out and sign the enclosed Dodd-Frank Certification and send back to us.

This deadline is real - don't risk being dropped from this chance to close your second mortgage."

Before I sign and send it back to them, I'd like to ask everyone's thoughts as I came up with the following questions:

1) Why is Citi offering me this when all my debts were already discharged through BK7? My 1st mortgage (Sallie Mae) was permanently modified way after the discharge.
2) What are the qualifications for loan closure?
3) If the 2nd mortgage is closed, is the lien considered released automatically?
4) Are there any fees associated with this procedure?
5) Are there any tax consequences tied up to this process, if any?

Thanks for your time, everyone and congrats to those who had their 2nd mortgages extinguised.
marimar

Thanks for your post. I recommend you seize this offer post haste, as full extinguishments aren't common.

I'm answering just one question (the others can readily be answered by Citi and your tax person.

1) Although your debt was discharged in your BK, the lien remains and eventually, when your property appreciates enough that your Citi loan is clearly "in the money", Citi could FC. Hence, a full extinguishment is very meaningful.
 

silverwesoke

LoanSafe Member
Jan 5, 2011
48
0
0
Marimar..

The wording that they are using in the letter is what is odd..After a BK, you have already closed the "loan" or promissory note part of it becuase they can no longer try to collect on that debt under any circumstances..What remains is a "lien " on your property.. which would come into play if you tried to sell. From the letter, I would assume they are talking about taking the entire thing off the books, but you would want to know for sure about the "lien" This lien is recorded as a deed of trust in your county recorders office and you can view it there.

If it were me, Id try to find out what "closing of the loan" means to them, and see /ask what will happen to the lien. You can always sign the paperwork and watch to see if there is a "release of lien" that is recorded in the county along with the others.

Hope this helps; Good luck. Sounds like you are almost finished!
 

joeinchicago

LoanSafe Member
Mar 9, 2012
6
0
0
Chicago, IL
Update:
After 6 months of continual going back and forth with CitiMortgage (they kept on asking for more and more info...much was repetitive info), I was denied a modification. What they are saying is that my gross income is not enough reletive to the combined 1st and 2nd mortgages (both with CitiMortgage). I have not been late on any payments, have been struggling to do it...but I have done it! So as to not ruin my credit. I have a business and if I ruin my personal credit, then I ruin my business credit. This seems to be what CitiMortgage wants me to do. That is stop making payments...ruin my credit...and give them the opportunity to take my home. Wouldn't it seem practical to grant me a modification so that it will be easier to make the payments and lowering my Loan to income ratio?

Also, I am $70K upside down on my overall mortgage (according to Zillow). Isn't this more reason to either modify or extinguish my 2nd Lien Mortgage?

To recap, I have a 1st mortgage with CitiMortgage that was modified a few years ago to 3.65%.
I have a 2nd lien mortgage also with CitiMortgage with an interest rate of 6.99%. I am paying $500 in interest alone on the 2nd mortgage!

I feel that CitiMortgage had falsely appraised my home when taking out the home equity loan at a ridiculously high value 5 yrs ago. The home is now assessed at less than half of what it was assessed at by CitiMortgage. Should I hire an attorney?

Anybody have suggestions? Should I just stop paying on the 2nd Mortgage?

I cannot get a conventional refi...tried that. My debt to income ratio is too high (but have been paying it down).
 

Cat Damiano

Mortgage Wars
Sep 10, 2007
10,541
39
48
Colorado
www.loansafe.org
Hi Joe,


Unfortunately, you know what they say, hind sight is 20/20 and if only we had a crystal ball to glimpse into the future before making bad decisions, that would be great. If you felt that the appraisal at the time was over inflated, why did you accept the loan amount and terms and not contest the appraisal?

We would be unable to advise you on whether or not to stop paying your second mortgage, however, if that is the route you have been thinking of going, there is a great thread on how to go about settling your second here;

http://www.loansafe.org/forum/debt-settlement/37996-strategy-settling-your-2nd.html
 

joeinchicago

LoanSafe Member
Mar 9, 2012
6
0
0
Chicago, IL
I would not necessarily call it a bad decision on my part. I needed funds to make important home improvements, assuming that it was important to maintain the long term value of my home and investment. As a consumer, we look to our lenders for not only financial assistance but also for guidance with a tinge of moral responsibility. They made it too easy to get a home equity loan at that time and I would have been much better off without it at all or a much less amount. I would have adapted and either saved money or done less on improvements.

I find it interesting that there was no requirement for financials at the time of getting the loan (stated income) and not a physical home assessment. But now after submitting virtually everything hook line and sinker (and being honest about it), I am now somehow not making enough to support it.

Unlike many people out there, I'll continue to accept the responsibility of my loan(s). All I want is a lower interest rate. Why is that so unreasonable? 6.99% according to today's standards is ridiculous.

Once again, the bank isn't looking at the bigger picture of having a long term customer.
My business accounts with Citibank is a huge asset that is being overlooked.
 

Cat Damiano

Mortgage Wars
Sep 10, 2007
10,541
39
48
Colorado
www.loansafe.org
It has happened to many of us here, especially those of us who are/were self employed, had the income, but had no options other than the stated income programs.

If the first lien is affordable and you want to stay in the home, the first post in the link I provided has information on the steps to take to work on a settlement of your second lien.
 

marimar

LoanSafe Member
Jul 19, 2011
17
0
1
California
Hi Tom,

Good news - I followed your advice and sent the required doc to my 2nd lender right away. A week later, it sent me a response letter stating the acct is now closed. I'm now waiting for lien release notice from the county.

Thanks for your help and good luck to everyone else trying to get their 2nd mortgage forgiven.
 

TomEason

LoanSafe Guide
Jun 18, 2009
12,390
85
48
SF Bay Area CA
Hi Tom,

Good news - I followed your advice and sent the required doc to my 2nd lender right away. A week later, it sent me a response letter stating the acct is now closed. I'm now waiting for lien release notice from the county.

Thanks for your help and good luck to everyone else trying to get their 2nd mortgage forgiven.
Hi marimar

Thanks for your follow-up.

Yes, it is good news - congratulations! Would you mind posting your story on the success stories thread? I'd appreciate it.

http://www.loansafe.org/forum/debt-settlement/40564-success-stories-settling-2nds.html
 

Coolgeek

LoanSafe Member
Jan 29, 2013
1
0
0
I just received a check from GreenTree returning my Dec payment with an invoice stating 2MP-Extinguished as description. I got a modification from my primary mortgage company Wells Fargo about a year ago. GreenTree had been harrassing me and threatening to take my house for about 6 months even though I gave them whatever I could afford. They finally sent me to their "last chance" dept and we worked out a $124.48 a month until I get back on my feet. I paid dilegently for a year and a half, then came a Dodd-Frank Cert that was due 2 weeks ago. It stated that if I didn't sign and return before the deadline that I would be disqualified as being eligible. I called GreenTree and the rep told me to sign it anyways and send it back along with a letter of explanation and photocopies of the Fed-ex envelope it was sent in to prove I received after deadline. I sent it in with little hope and 2 months went by. Then came the check, I called and my balance due with them is zero. I just sent another $124.48 a couple of days ago which they said will be returned. I am so surprised that this happened...a balance of $28,000+ is now gone.

If you get a Dodd-Frank Cert sent to you, sign it and return ASAP. I gave up hope on mine and they still came through.
 

Cat Damiano

Mortgage Wars
Sep 10, 2007
10,541
39
48
Colorado
www.loansafe.org
I just received a check from GreenTree returning my Dec payment with an invoice stating 2MP-Extinguished as description. I got a modification from my primary mortgage company Wells Fargo about a year ago. GreenTree had been harrassing me and threatening to take my house for about 6 months even though I gave them whatever I could afford. They finally sent me to their "last chance" dept and we worked out a $124.48 a month until I get back on my feet. I paid dilegently for a year and a half, then came a Dodd-Frank Cert that was due 2 weeks ago. It stated that if I didn't sign and return before the deadline that I would be disqualified as being eligible. I called GreenTree and the rep told me to sign it anyways and send it back along with a letter of explanation and photocopies of the Fed-ex envelope it was sent in to prove I received after deadline. I sent it in with little hope and 2 months went by. Then came the check, I called and my balance due with them is zero. I just sent another $124.48 a couple of days ago which they said will be returned. I am so surprised that this happened...a balance of $28,000+ is now gone.

If you get a Dodd-Frank Cert sent to you, sign it and return ASAP. I gave up hope on mine and they still came through.
Welcome to the forum and thank you for joining..........

Thanks for sharing your story about your second lien becoming extinguished as a result of the HAMP 2MP program, that is such great news. Congratulations to you!
 

cartoonspin

LoanSafe Member
Nov 11, 2008
5
0
1
Orlando Florida
I need guidance. I went ahead and applied for a modification and after one year Citibank finally approved it for my second. In August 2012 they stated I needed to make a payment by October 5, 2012 and then they would send my the documents for the reduced interest and payment of which to this day I have never received it. I call them every two weeks and they state they will look into it.

I called the automated number and they state the new balance and the payment due on November 1, 2012 but no past due amounts or anything. What do I do next? This would make the second time this was modified and would love to have them send me a Dodd-Frank Certificate since I am under water with even the modified second. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance!!!
 

Cat Damiano

Mortgage Wars
Sep 10, 2007
10,541
39
48
Colorado
www.loansafe.org
I need guidance. I went ahead and applied for a modification and after one year Citibank finally approved it for my second. In August 2012 they stated I needed to make a payment by October 5, 2012 and then they would send my the documents for the reduced interest and payment of which to this day I have never received it. I call them every two weeks and they state they will look into it.

I called the automated number and they state the new balance and the payment due on November 1, 2012 but no past due amounts or anything. What do I do next? This would make the second time this was modified and would love to have them send me a Dodd-Frank Certificate since I am under water with even the modified second. Any thoughts? Thanks in advance!!!
For the National Mortgage Settlement the second lien would have to be serviced and backed by CitiMortgage;

https://www.citimortgage.com/Mortgage/displayHomeOwnerAssistance.do?page=settlement

In order to escalate your file you can try contacting the executive response unit here;

CitiMortgage Executive Response Team
(1-636-261-7200)

Mike Cardace, Citi
[email protected]
 

charlark

LoanSafe Member
May 29, 2010
5
0
0
orange county, CA
Is there any hope for a 2mp for me? I recieved a MHA loan mod on my first on Sept. 7, 2010. I have been following up - daily-weekly-monthly- on the 2MP ever since.
The first year of calls, I was told "be patient, it could take up to 3 months; 6 months; a year."

After about a year, I was told there was an address mismatch. The HELOC had the old county address, which was changed long before we bought the house. I had to get a letter from the postmaster general, which took me about 6 months to do, stating the address was changed. They could not use common sense, or the fact that we are the only house on our street in the city.


I have faxed in the MHA loan papers numerous times. I rarely get to speak to the same rep. I have spoken to many supervisors. This year, I am told mostly that the 2mp is generated automatically by the government, and B of A has no control over it. Or they tell me to apply for an in-house modification. We night not be under water with our mortgage any more, now with housing prices going up a little.

Financially, we are in a better position that 3 years ago, but it is the principle of the matter.... I qualified for the 2MP, and was not given the offer, despite great time and effort on my part. Also, we owe $65 on our HELOC, which is adjustible, up to 18% interest, currently at 5%. What should I do?
 

TomEason

LoanSafe Guide
Jun 18, 2009
12,390
85
48
SF Bay Area CA
charlark

Is there any hope for a 2mp for me? I recieved a MHA loan mod on my first on Sept. 7, 2010. I have been following up - daily-weekly-monthly- on the 2MP ever since. The first year of calls, I was told "be patient, it could take up to 3 months; 6 months; a year." After about a year, I was told there was an address mismatch. The HELOC had the old county address, which was changed long before we bought the house. I had to get a letter from the postmaster general, which took me about 6 months to do, stating the address was changed. They could not use common sense, or the fact that we are the only house on our street in the city. I have faxed in the MHA loan papers numerous times. I rarely get to speak to the same rep. I have spoken to many supervisors. This year, I am told mostly that the 2mp is generated automatically by the government, and B of A has no control over it. Or they tell me to apply for an in-house modification. We night not be under water with our mortgage any more, now with housing prices going up a little. Financially, we are in a better position that 3 years ago, but it is the principle of the matter.... I qualified for the 2MP, and was not given the offer, despite great time and effort on my part. Also, we owe $65 on our HELOC, which is adjustible, up to 18% interest, currently at 5%. What should I do?
Thanks for your post. I recommend you immediately stop making payments on the HELOC. If that loan is underwater, BOA won't FC. I recommend you seek to eventually settle by following the guide at post #1 of the following thread. FYI, 2MPs are never as good for the borrower as a settlement. IMO 2MPs aren't worth spending your time and effort pursuing. Good luck. http://www.loansafe.org/forum/debt-settlement/37996-strategy-settling-your-2nd-94.html
 

charlark

LoanSafe Member
May 29, 2010
5
0
0
orange county, CA
Thank you for your advice. I am working hard to increase my credit score- now just over 700, so hesitate to stop payments, but I will read the other threads.
 

cartoonspin

LoanSafe Member
Nov 11, 2008
5
0
1
Orlando Florida
Tom, I have begun to follow your strategy for my 2nd mortgage. I had a modification in play and they approved it. While I was waiting for the letter for me to sign come to my mailbox, they backdoored it to the collections department. I really feel this was horrible and when I spoke to the collections lady she said I should get over it. I gave them no information and I have no plan in talking to them. I plan on waiting on settling this and saving up money for this? If they do reach out with an offer, will it be by phone or letter?

Thank you for all you do!
 

TomEason

LoanSafe Guide
Jun 18, 2009
12,390
85
48
SF Bay Area CA
Hi cartoonspin

Tom, I have begun to follow your strategy for my 2nd mortgage. I had a modification in play and they approved it. While I was waiting for the letter for me to sign come to my mailbox, they backdoored it to the collections department. I really feel this was horrible and when I spoke to the collections lady she said I should get over it. I gave them no information and I have no plan in talking to them. I plan on waiting on settling this and saving up money for this? If they do reach out with an offer, will it be by phone or letter? Thank you for all you do!
Thanks for your post and for your kind remark. Your plan to settle is sound - I commend you for that. A lender will usually send a settlement offer by mail. However occcasionally a lender will call and leave a message stating they have an offer for you. If that occurs, I recommend you call the person back. In either case, I recommend you submit your counteroffer only by mail.
 

mmota

LoanSafe Member
Jun 8, 2011
17
0
1
Hi there,
My home is in FL, I am trying to have my Citi Heloc extinguished after the HARP rejected me because citi heloc could not subordinate to my 1st with Chase; my Citi heloc ($185K) was charged-off Feb/2013, and it is now with "Real Time Resolutions" collections. I expressed my desire to settle, bu no body is calling me to settle yet.

I followed the Strategy to Settle my 2nd. I know it takes time, and I do not want to miss applying to the the HAMP and try to have my citi heloc extinguished or settle through this 2MP program.

Couple of questions;
1- Should I wait for citi to call me and settle or Should I apply to the HAMP?
2-Home prices have increased, now my home is worth $285K - (1st $160) - (REO $50K) = ($75K) left for citi heloc.
Would Citi FC on me trying to get the $75?

I am getting very nervous, can not sleep.
Thanks.
Mark
 

TomEason

LoanSafe Guide
Jun 18, 2009
12,390
85
48
SF Bay Area CA
mmota

Hi there, My home is in FL, I am trying to have my Citi Heloc extinguished after the HARP rejected me because citi heloc could not subordinate to my 1st with Chase; my Citi heloc ($185K) was charged-off Feb/2013, and it is now with "Real Time Resolutions" collections. I expressed my desire to settle, bu no body is calling me to settle yet. I followed the Strategy to Settle my 2nd. I know it takes time, and I do not want to miss applying to the the HAMP and try to have my citi heloc extinguished or settle through this 2MP program. Couple of questions; 1- Should I wait for citi to call me and settle or Should I apply to the HAMP? 2-Home prices have increased, now my home is worth $285K - (1st $160) - (REO $50K) = ($75K) left for citi heloc. Would Citi FC on me trying to get the $75? I am getting very nervous, can not sleep. Thanks. Mark
Thanks for your post. Your CITI 2nd is underwater by $110K and therefore won't FC. $285K-$160K-$185K-$50K= <$110K> I recommend you continue to follow the strategy. The general rule of them is to not deal with one's 2nd until the 1st is permanently handled.
 

mmota

LoanSafe Member
Jun 8, 2011
17
0
1
Hi there,
My home is in FL, I am trying to have my Citi Heloc extinguished after the HARP rejected me because citi heloc could not subordinate to my 1st with Chase; my Citi heloc ($185K) was charged-off Feb/2013, and it is now with "Real Time Resolutions" collections. I expressed my desire to settle, bu no body is calling me to settle yet.

I followed the Strategy to Settle my 2nd. I know it takes time, and I do not want to miss applying to the the HAMP and try to have my citi heloc extinguished or settle through this 2MP program.

Couple of questions;
1- Should I wait for citi to call me and settle or Should I apply to the HAMP?
2-Home prices have increased, now my home is worth $285K - (1st $160) - (REO $50K) = ($75K) left for citi heloc.
Would Citi FC on me trying to get the $75?

I am getting very nervous, can not sleep.
Thanks.
Mark
I stopped paying my citi heloc May 2012, it was charged-off Feb. 2013. Now Real Time Resolutions is trying to collect. I am confused, because it seems like Real Time Resolutions needs approval from Citi heloc to do anything or negotiate Even billing statements ask for checks to be made to Citi.
Can Real Time Resolutions collections FC on my house, do I still have a change to Settle with Citi? (the Strategy to Settle Second thread is not clear).
I followed the Strategy to Settle 2nd, but since Citi is on the money ($75) I may get a FC letter surprise without a chance to settle.
 
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