Substitution of Trustee and Full Reconveyance from County Recorder?

[Daphne]

We received two documents from our County recorder in Sacramento ca.
I don't know what they mean for us. One is a Substitution of Trustee and the other is a Full Reconveyance ont the Heloc. When I google these terms they appear to be removing the lien, like when the loan is satisfied.This second, Heloc, is in default for 20 months, the first is current. the property taxes were behind but are on a payment plan now. We have had the second bounced to three different CA's and back to the original lender. We have talked on the phone once, they call every day, and they spoke of settling the $50k helocn for $15k which we passed on. Then in the mail we got these recorded documents with the right address description and the right loan number. We got no letter of forgiveness or notice of any kind just the docs.

What does this Full Reconveyance mean? Is the second gone? Is the debt still there? Second was charged off June of 2011. No more calls from the lender this week. House is underwater below the first. We live on my SSDI and Dis pension and they know this.

I have asked a title company for a property profile and they did not show on there, at least not yet. I asked our local free legal advice call center and they had some potential ideas what they mean, but recommended spending some money on a real estate lawyer's advice. Last I checked with a real estate agent we know and she said to just call the lender to see what they mean.

[Daphne]

I wanted to add that the two docs did show up on the online recorder page. I read this site everyday looking to see how others have tried and succeeded at settling their seconds. Should I have posted this thread in a different section of the forum?

[Daphne]

Wow, we just a letter of loan forgiveness from Wells today. We did not get one before the two docs I was asking about earlier. I don't know why they did this but I am glad to have this looming problem hanging over our heads.

Now to go back and try to modify the 1st again.

[Richard70]

Daphne, I've received these two docs. from WF last week. I did not expect it at all. My second loan was with 3 diffrent collection agencies for more than two years and they were trying to settle for 10% that I did not accept. The amount of second loan was $95,000 and they were asking for $9,000. I did not answer their calls for 4 months and then the calls stopped. Last week I recieved substitution of trustee & full reconveyence from county recorder. I called title company , the second lien had been removed from title. now I am waiting for WF forgiveness letter, any idea how long does it take for WF to send out that letter. I'm still in shock.

[Daphne]

The letter came two weeks later. It is a very non-descript form letter that explains that your loan is forgiven and that you don't have to do anything. We were also trying to settle our loan and had mailed an offer in the same time they sent the two docs. After we got the forgiveness letter, Wells sent us another letter telling us that our offer was too low and not acceptable. So we are done with the second. I don't know how long it will take for this to show on our credit but when we checked in Sept it was still showing the same balance and charged off. We are now trying to refinance our first ( wells again). Our first attempt witha broker was unsuccessful and he told us that the forgiveness is treated like a foreclosure and no new lender would be interested .He said to try a harp 2 with Wells. We will see how that goes. Congratulations on surviving your second.

Daphne, I've received these two docs. from WF last week. I did not expect it at all. My second loan was with 3 diffrent collection agencies for more than two years and they were trying to settle for 10% that I did not accept. The amount of second loan was $95,000 and they were asking for $9,000. I did not answer their calls for 4 months and then the calls stopped. Last week I recieved substitution of trustee & full reconveyence from county recorder. I called title company , the second lien had been removed from title. now I am waiting for WF forgiveness letter, any idea how long does it take for WF to send out that letter. I'm still in shock.

[Richard70]

Thanks Daphne, As I mentioned title company told me that the second lien had been removed and I also asked them to email me the docs. that they have reg. this full reconveyance , and they did. on the other hand I checked my balance with WF but it still showes the $95,000 balance, WF told me to contact collection agency for the status of the case they said it doesn't show on their system because they transfer the case to collection agency but I just wanted to wait for forgiveness letter. Thank you again and good luck on your new journey

[NorCalJumbo]

I too have received the trustee and reconveyance letters from my county recorder's office showing Wells Fargo has removed the lien from my house (second mortgage). I have not, however, gotten a letter of forgiveness, and it has been about 1 month since receiving the other two letters. Daphne and/or Richard, was your HELOC purchase money? I kind of think they sold to a debt collector, which I may settle with for pennies on the dollar. Without the lien, I have little incentive to pay. I'm curious as to how Well's 'debt forgiveness' will impact a credit score vs paying paying off a collection account.

[No_Kidding]

That is great news! Congrats!!

I am eagerly waiting for such a letter from my county recorder's office. I haven't pait or contacted WF heloc for 13 months now. About time they move on and release lien.

How long it took you to get to this point?

I too have received the trustee and reconveyance letters from my county recorder's office showing Wells Fargo has removed the lien from my house (second mortgage). I have not, however, gotten a letter of forgiveness, and it has been about 1 month since receiving the other two letters. Daphne and/or Richard, was your HELOC purchase money? I kind of think they sold to a debt collector, which I may settle with for pennies on the dollar. Without the lien, I have little incentive to pay. I'm curious as to how Well's 'debt forgiveness' will impact a credit score vs paying paying off a collection account.

[Daphne]

Ours was in default for 20 months and we were chosen to be included in their Mortgage settlement and they did not say why. Wells did say there is a predetermined list of who is getting these loan forgiveness's and that our first mortgage (with Wells also) was not on this list. You should call the main Wells number and see if your account is on this list or not. The collections and recovery dept won't know or won't tell, at least they did not in our case and were calling up to the day we got the loan forgiveness letter.

[Richard70]

NorCaljumbo,
Yes, mine was HELOC. and I'm still waiting for the letter of forgiveness. The impact on credit score should be the same , we will see when WF report it to credit bureau.I want to check my credit score after I see $0.00 balance on my WF HELOC account, let's cross our fingers!

[Daphne]

We took our our Heloc or line of credit to finish a remodel/addition.

While in default, they sent our account to three different collectors and even charged it off but I don't think they ever sold it to any of them. The collectors have some authority to settle for less but when your offer is below their required minimum, I think they have to get OK from Wells . We tried repeatedly to get proof of who owned the note and then get an ok to settle. They would then transfer our note to another collector. We, as a rule would not answer their calls, until ready to make serious settlement offer, which they rejected as too low.Then out of nowhere, they forgave the loan.
With the lien gone you have no incentive to pay. We were told that a forgiveness is being treated the same as foreclosure by the lenders as we are still trying to refinance our first.

I too have received the trustee and reconveyance letters from my county recorder's office showing Wells Fargo has removed the lien from my house (second mortgage). I have not, however, gotten a letter of forgiveness, and it has been about 1 month since receiving the other two letters. Daphne and/or Richard, was your HELOC purchase money? I kind of think they sold to a debt collector, which I may settle with for pennies on the dollar. Without the lien, I have little incentive to pay. I'm curious as to how Well's 'debt forgiveness' will impact a credit score vs paying paying off a collection account.

[Daveerik]

Ours was in default for 20 months and we were chosen to be included in their Mortgage settlement and they did not say why. Wells did say there is a predetermined list of who is getting these loan forgiveness's and that our first mortgage (with Wells also) was not on this list. You should call the main Wells number and see if your account is on this list or not. The collections and recovery dept won't know or won't tell, at least they did not in our case and were calling up to the day we got the loan forgiveness letter.

A follow up question. Do you have any contact info at Wells For this predetermined list? And who told you they had this list? That would be great for me to be able to call?
thanks

[No_Kidding]

Daphne, Richard70, and NorCalDumbo - Congratulations to all of you on getting your heloc behind. It is encouraging that finally WF is coming around to forgiving charged off second loans. I am waiting for mine one of these days.

Daphne and NorCalDumbo, if you don't mind, you should post your success story on Success Stories in Settling 2nds

Many members are tied to that thread and WF forgiveness is sure a welcome story on that board.

[Daphne]

A follow up question. Do you have any contact info at Wells For this predetermined list? And who told you they had this list? That would be great for me to be able to call?
thanks

If I recall correctly, I called the customer service 800 number like you would to check your balance, payments, etc. When you get a live person ask them directly if your account is listed for loan forgiveness. They will either confirm that you are or aren't. I don't know the time frame for when they notify people.

If they say you are not on the list, ask the reason why not? I asked if my first was included and they said we had been in default in the past 12 months on the first, which was true but is not any longer, and therefore we did not qualify. The lady also said there was no appeal or other way to get on this one time settlement. I was told by one of the moderators on here, Cat, that this was untrue and to file a complaint, but have not done so yet.

I am waiting until Dec 1 and then will have 12 months with no default and try again for something, refinance to fixed, loan mod,loan forgiveness for the first to go with my already received loan forgiveness on the second. The main Wells number is on your mortgage bill. Please update us what they say.

[Daphne]

[QUOTE=No_Kidding;429679]Daphne, Richard70, and NorCalDumbo - Congratulations to all of you on getting your heloc behind. It is encouraging that finally WF is coming around to forgiving charged off second loans. I am waiting for mine one of these days.

Daphne and NorCalDumbo, if you don't mind, you should post your success story on Success Stories in Settling 2nds

I don't know how to repost onto the success stories thread. I also don't know what strategy worked. We stopped paying both first and seconds, both with Wells, Stopped answering their calls and unsuccessfully tried to get loan mods on both. After the first moved to foreclose, we got enough money together to make the first current and then stopped paying again to try for another loan mod. No success again and another foreclosure. Again we scraped up enough to catch up the first. The loan then adjusted and went down enough for us to keep the payments current. We were now 20 months behind on second and had been sent to 3 CA's and tried to settle with all of them. Wells HE then tried to settle for 30% and we offered 3%. They declined the offer in writing. Then they sent us the loan forgiveness and that is where we are now.

So I don't what combination of actions made us the lucky recipients of the Mortgage Settlement on our second. maybe having the first current now, and the denied loan mods? Still not out of the woods as our first, while low rate now, adjusts every Jan. We will continue to work extra and spend little just in case of the rate adjusting up before we can refinance.

[Daveerik]

If anyone calls Welss to see if there is a list of foregiven HELOCS, please update this board, I am chicken to call

thanks

[Daphne]

Why be scared? Your already in default, credit score damaged, etc. What else can they do besides ask for a payment? Remember to call the main bank number and not the people who have been calling the house or the collections.

You can do this.

[Daveerik]

So I called weels Fargo to see if I was on a list to have my HELOC extinguished. I called the general line and the represenative states Wells was not doing any foregiveness but I could make a payment. Anyone else have any success calling lately? Any phone numbers would be great

[Daphne]

When we called, we had already been notified about the loan forgiveness on the second and were calling to see if there was any similar news concerning the first. They checked our account number and said the first did not qualify. I think that since you have not gotten a forgiveness letter by now than your loan is not on the list. I don't know for sure but I assume they sent them all out at once and the amount forgiven is part of the overall mortgage settlement they agreed to.

So once they have fulfilled their legal obligation they are done with loan forgiveness. We may have just gotten lucky and had all of the right boxes checked.

[Daveerik]

Ok so just called again, and this representaive told me we were on the list to have our Wells Fargo Heloc foregiven So Excited. I will post to success stories once complete.

[No_Kidding]

I called Wells HELOC and they transferred me to charge off department as my loan has bee charged off for few months now. The rep told me that my loan is not marked for forgiveness. I shall call collection agency to arrange for payment...blah blah..

Plan to call again next week and see what happens.

[No_Kidding]

Hi Daveerik,

Congrats!! Do you mind sharing what state your HELOC is in? Mine is 180+ days delinquent and WF has only 10 cents on a dollar motivation to forgive the loan. I wonder if some of the loans they forgave have better incentives for them.

Ok so just called again, and this representaive told me we were on the list to have our Wells Fargo Heloc foregiven So Excited. I will post to success stories once complete.

[samIam]

1st WF now current (wf almost foreclosed down to the day)
2nd WF charged off equity loan with lien 250k +- trying to negotiate with CA for 10 cents they say WF wants 30..standard #$%^
3rd WF charged off Heloc 120K+- trying to negotiate with CA for 10 cents as well

Today we received a letter of FULL Reconveyance for the HELOC. I am not sure what is going on with the second and if the equity loan will be
forgiven as well but I haven't heard from the CA's in a while (3 weeks or so). I don't know why WF would forgive a loan when they wouldn't in the first place
refinance me, then i asked for a modification, then negotiate payment. They were unwilling to give me any help and then they just forgive the loan?????
Is this a tactic in order for the second to be in a better position to sue me and foreclose??

[Daveerik]

1st WF now current (wf almost foreclosed down to the day)
2nd WF charged off equity loan with lien 250k +- trying to negotiate with CA for 10 cents they say WF wants 30..standard #$%^
3rd WF charged off Heloc 120K+- trying to negotiate with CA for 10 cents as well

Today we received a letter of FULL Reconveyance for the HELOC. I am not sure what is going on with the second and if the equity loan will be
forgiven as well but I haven't heard from the CA's in a while (3 weeks or so). I don't know why WF would forgive a loan when they wouldn't in the first place
refinance me, then i asked for a modification, then negotiate payment. They were unwilling to give me any help and then they just forgive the loan?????
Is this a tactic in order for the second to be in a better poshition to sue me and foreclose??

Can you tell me if this came fedex
Thanks

[Daphne]

They did the same with us. I believe that they have a monetary amount they have to fulfil as part of the Settlement and we are just in the right place with the right set of circumstances. i don't think you will be sued or foreclosed on as long as you keep the first current.

We are now awaiting the 1099C form to see the tax consequences of this forgiveness. Since it is our primary residence I think we won't have any problems.

Congradulation on your loan forgiveness

[Daveerik]

Can you tell me when this happened? and when the mail came? Last I heard is I was in final revue 12/20 and not a word since
thanks

They did the same with us. I believe that they have a monetary amount they have to fulfil as part of the Settlement and we are just in the right place with the right set of circumstances. i don't think you will be sued or foreclosed on as long as you keep the first current.

We are now awaiting the 1099C form to see the tax consequences of this forgiveness. Since it is our primary residence I think we won't have any problems.

Congradulation on your loan forgiveness

[Daveerik]

I call the 888 667 1772 and does it still have a balan ce

[Daphne]

The notice came is in a regular letter, The official conveyance docs came seperately and have the original county stickers on them, not copies. Like getting a pink slip.

It took a long time to get the balance to show as zero and also stayed unchanged on the credit reports for a long time. But , no more calls.

[samIam]

Can you tell me if this came fedexThanks

No it didn't. Standard mail.

[Essence]

The notice came is in a regular letter, The official conveyance docs came seperately and have the original county stickers on them, not copies. Like getting a pink slip.

It took a long time to get the balance to show as zero and also stayed unchanged on the credit reports for a long time. But , no more calls.

Hello! Just received 2 letters from the county;substitution of trustee and full reconveyance. I hope I read your thread correctly and these mean they have released my second.

[duganrm]

Hello! Just received 2 letters from the county;substitution of trustee and full reconveyance. I hope I read your thread correctly and these mean they have released my second.

I got these same letters today. I am hoping the same thing. This would be great news and mean I am done with all my mortgage/heloc issues.

[duganrm]

I got these same letters today. I am hoping the same thing. This would be great news and mean I am done with all my mortgage/heloc issues.

I got the paperwork today! They are forgiving the unpaid balance and releasing the lien on my property.

[californialove]

My mom received the same thing full reconveyance 1 week ago in the mail from county recorder and forgiveness from bank on Saturdays mail!!!

I got the paperwork today! They are forgiving the unpaid balance and releasing the lien on my property.

[TomEason]

Congratulations on your full extinguishments! What a happy surprise. Would you all mind posting your stories in the Success Stories thread? Thanks! Success Stories in Settling 2nds

[shloan]

Congratulations on your full extinguishments! What a happy surprise. Would you all mind posting your stories in the Success Stories thread? Thanks! Success Stories in Settling 2nds

My second mortgage was HELOC, its was delinquent since last two years. Now my credit report shows GMAC charged off and balance is 0. Also just two days back, the subsititution of trustee was filled with county. I am in CA. teh HELOC was purchased money. What does the substitution of attorney mean here ? why is it filled ? does it mean the bank has removed the lien for HELOC from property ? Is this called forgiveness. But if that happens, dont we still owe money to some Collection Agency who has now got the responsibility to recover money from us ??

[Octanefam]

Ok we have WF 2nd 47k balance and this is what has happen so far:

Recd letter asking to settle for 26k lol...
WF charged off ssecond
Recently was on county website and there was a full reconveyance from WF
Oh BTW no phone calls from WF for long while either
How do I know if they sold to Collection agency?

So what should I expect next??

Thanks

[TomEason]

Ok we have WF 2nd 47k balance and this is what has happen so far:Recd letter asking to settle for 26k lol...WF charged off ssecondRecently was on county website and there was a full reconveyance from WFOh BTW no phone calls from WF for long while eitherHow do I know if they sold to Collection agency?So what should I expect next??Thanks

Thanks for your post. You'll find out if WF sold the debt to a CA if and when you receive a letter from that CA.

[mayela]

Thanks for your post. You'll find out if WF sold the debt to a CA if and when you receive a letter from that CA.

Will you receive a 1099 for the 2nd heloc Wells Fargo forgave and released? What are the tax consequences?

[TomEason]

Will you receive a 1099 for the 2nd heloc Wells Fargo forgave and released? What are the tax consequences?

Thanks for your post. If a WF HELOC loan was recourse, the borrower would be liable for tax due to CODI. That is, unless the borrower can qualify for exemption under the provisions of the Mortgage Forgiveness Debt Relief Act. I recommend you consult with your tax person.

[mayela]

Thanks for your post. If a WF HELOC loan was recourse, the borrower would be liable for tax due to CODI. That is, unless the borrower can qualify for exemption under the provisions of the Mortgage Forgiveness Debt Relief Act. I recommend you consult with your tax person.

How do I know if was recourse? what is CODI?

Thank You