Wells Fargo Modification Denied

[jallen]

Hi,
I am one step ahead of you...I called back and spoke to one of the executive phone folks...she informed me as to the status of our mitigation process...our loan is now waiting the the brokers pricing opinion process. I know they use zillow.com...and if that is what they are doing we are totally you know what....zillow.com only has old information and not what we had added to improve the value of our home...yes I updated it...but you know...they will go by the neighborhood comps....and like everyone else...we have all lost value in our investment. I don't know if we are going to be able to keep our home or not......I am doing everything that I can...Thank you for your response...

[fnuri]

dcguy, i have had WF LM team review my case for 3 months as well with no tangible feedback and when i finally called the Exec # that i got from this forum, they said it actually was denied because of high deficit (-$2500). then i told them we actually have improved our finances by closing some credit card debts and modifying 2 of our 2nd mortgages, in adittion to some basic savings. they are sending me new forms to fill out with the new financial data. they never mentioned DTI, just end-of-the-month deificit so i am hoping that will suffice because my FE DTI is around 31% already and BE DTI is sitting at around 60%. btw, i was able to reduce my monthly deficit to around $350 as well. they can put me in +ive if they reduce my interest rate to 4.5% and extend the term to back to 30yrs. will keep you posted...

[nbtapia1]

Originally Posted by dcguy

Hi All -

Our loan modification got denied yesterday and the reason was due to our big monthly deficit. This deficit is due to my husbands job loss. The monthly deficit was around $1900. So WF ERT asked me to send the updated financials worksheet.

To make our monthly deficit low .... following are the items we are working on:
(1) we are planning to rent out our basement. Do you guys know if thats ok? would there be any tax implications or some unknowns in the furture? Or should we do a Paying Guest deal? One person is ready to rent out our basement also .. so should we do the paperwork saying that the person is renting our basement or should we document the person as a paying guest?
(2) We are significantly reducing our basic expenses and childcare costs.

After doing this ..... our monthly deficit will go down from $1900 to $300 i.e. we are still -$300. Do you guys know if we would be eligible for modification now? Since my case is dealt by ERT ... can I hope for something good?

Please share your thoughts.

Thanks.

Hi dcguy
Are you including mortgage payment to WF in your financial worksheet?

[madresmustang]

I am wondering what all the programs are. The President's plan spoke to be helping people in the circumstances your in. Modifications due to job loss were supposed to be a priority, not the houses people bought but couldn't afford to begin with.

I would look at the IRS website, they have a tax calculator there. I don't think there is a difference in the income type "paying guest or renter" to the IRS income is income. On the forms there is the column "Other Income" I was taught during a tax course that this is where Any income you get beyond the job, investments, self-employment, royalties and such. You are to report monies earned from garage sales, gambling, selling drugs or prostitution. It's funny because they think you'll report income on monies earned from committing a crime

As to the modification I would try www.naca.com/refinance/refinanceTenStep.jsp
I have started that process due to WF not communicating with me, not requesting financial documentation and then disqualifying me with out telling me. They offered me a 2nd loan to get caught up. I had 2 questions about the paperwork for that and never got them answered so I didn't sign the loan documents they sent. So they canceled that without notification to me and put me back to mitigation/foreclosure.

I am not getting any real help or communication from the EXEC Office person so I feel I need an outside person who they may actually listen to and work with.

Show in a Hardship letter how your husband is looking for work, that you are currently not having a child care bill. The only thing with that is they know you may have it again for you both to work. Is there a family member or friend who can help with child care when your husband first goes back to work?

You can show them where you are cutting back do this with showing them the percentages each item is in your budget originally and now that you have cut back the percentage on those which will shrink the % your mortgage is. Your mortgage shouldn't be more than 30% of your income normally it will be more now with job loss. I am following Dave Ramsey's Financial Peace University and Total Money Makeover, great programs and as Dave states first and foremost in the budget in hard times top priority to pay home, utilities, food, transportation (for work) all the rest can wait.

Keep us informed if not just for way to vent and get emotional support during this.

[jallen]

I received a call from the "loan
negotiator "....we do not qualify for a Loan Modification ...reason...she could not tell me why...because she did not know. Then she said because I had not missed any payments...

I was so exhausted and disappointed that I cried. She said she would re-run the program and see if she had entered any incorrect information..."WHAT"...Let me get this straight, as of Monday I was waiting on the investors reply, as of Tuesday, the drive by for the real estate appraisal...BUT the decision was based on a computer program...what happened to the investor, the drive by person, etc....You know what I think...this is a lot of bologna.

We are all facing life changing events...which on the stress scale put us about at a 10 (1 being the lowest level)....whether you have a sick spouse or lost your employment....it is a life changing event....

So let me get this straight, we have to depend on a computer program to make the decision...then why do we write hardship letters, initial pages, send in repeated financial statements, earning reports etc......someone needs to explain this to me...

Oh yes, of course she could not re-run the program yesterday, because the individual who runs the program was gone for the day...so please tell me, what does a loan negotiator do...what are the qualifications for the position....

Naturally she said she would call me back today. I have given up on that one...I really have lost my faith in WF.

[burrito]

I've been skimming through this site and starting to get the feeling that I won't qualify. My deficit is close to $3000 and I haven't been delinquent yet. I'm only in this situation because I've been laid off. All I need is job to say that the situation is improving. However, I've been job hunting for the past 8 months without an offer(not even being picky anymore) and I don't see the situation changing in the next 6 to 12 months.

I also have unemployment benefit and savings that would keep me afloat for next 5mo or so. Then, onto stocks, 401k and such. Then I'll be flat broke.

With that, why would WF approve an adjustment?

Any thoughts on this? Is it even worth the effort with the odds? I might as well use the time to look for work, perhaps.

BTW, When WF (supposedly) mailed the form to me 2 weeks ago, but it got lost--I never recieved it. Of all the mail transactions I've done in my life time, I know of only 2 cases of "lost mail." Both cases very important and urgent. WF being one of them. Is this one of their tricks that banks do?

[madresmustang]

Originally Posted by jallen

I received a call from the "loan
negotiator "....we do not qualify for a Loan Modification ...reason...she could not tell me why...because she did not know. Then she said because I had not missed any payments...

I was so exhausted and disappointed that I cried. She said she would re-run the program and see if she had entered any incorrect information..."WHAT"...Let me get this straight, as of Monday I was waiting on the investors reply, as of Tuesday, the drive by for the real estate appraisal...BUT the decision was based on a computer program...what happened to the investor, the drive by person, etc....You know what I think...this is a lot of bologna.

We are all facing life changing events...which on the stress scale put us about at a 10 (1 being the lowest level)....whether you have a sick spouse or lost your employment....it is a life changing event....

So let me get this straight, we have to depend on a computer program to make the decision...then why do we write hardship letters, initial pages, send in repeated financial statements, earning reports etc......someone needs to explain this to me...

Oh yes, of course she could not re-run the program yesterday, because the individual who runs the program was gone for the day...so please tell me, what does a loan negotiator do...what are the qualifications for the position....

Naturally she said she would call me back today. I have given up on that one...I really have lost my faith in WF.

I know how you feel atleast you got to send financial paperwork. Maybe you should double check, I was never asked to send financial documents. When I was told I only qualify for a 2nd loan (I'm a single parent, self-employed and work from the home) I asked where they got the info to review(asked for weeks). This past Mon. I finally found out they looked at my last years tax return and credit report. Okay well income last year is not what it is this year and I never gave them authorization to pull those. Last Fri. I was told to fax docs to Exec. Office person, was given wrong fax #.
Today is day 90 for starting a process that started with 1 payment behind. My former loan officer is now working with Exec. Office person (who keeps taking days off). He is giving her more information than I have gotten. I was going to sign 2nd loan papers so I could finally more foreward but had 2?, called him on the 29th of May, never heard from him to ask my ?'s. I am so sick of WF, I told my loan officer she was great I would share her name if she ever leaves WF. I will not recommend them at all. I can't advertise for new enrollment as long as I don't know if I get to keep my home. So I don't get to try and increase my income.

[jallen]

Just as soon as I finished my post yesterday the loan negoitator called me and said that now I qualified for the modification.

She re-ran the program, and again said sometimes it makes errors and apparently it had...while she was explaining the steps in the modification, I could tell she was a little annoyed. It was like she was performing a chore she did not what to do.

At the end of our conversation, she said they would be sending out the paperwork next Wednesday via UPS. So we will see if that actually goes as planned and the terms are exactly as she described them during our conversation.

She mentioned that over the next few years I will have to submitt additional financial statements/hardship letters and that I would be on a 90 day trial period.

With all the mix-ups, inaccurate information and errors, I still wonder why this is being made so difficult for people who really need help. There should be sometype of oversight board on their side...they don't seem to understand what it is like to be on our side of the fence.

Of the 100's of times that I called, no one ever mentioned the executive offices....only told me I could not speak to the loan negioators....I did speak to several supervisors...but nothing...just nothing...

I keep reading back through the posts, and it is so confusing because I thought the whole purpose of a loss mitigation/loan modification was because people who have faced life changing events were/are facing deficits.

[jallen]

Originally Posted by madresmustang

I know how you feel atleast you got to send financial paperwork. Maybe you should double check, I was never asked to send financial documents. When I was told I only qualify for a 2nd loan (I'm a single parent, self-employed and work from the home) I asked where they got the info to review(asked for weeks). This past Mon. I finally found out they looked at my last years tax return and credit report. Okay well income last year is not what it is this year and I never gave them authorization to pull those. Last Fri. I was told to fax docs to Exec. Office person, was given wrong fax #.
Today is day 90 for starting a process that started with 1 payment behind. My former loan officer is now working with Exec. Office person (who keeps taking days off). He is giving her more information than I have gotten. I was going to sign 2nd loan papers so I could finally more foreward but had 2?, called him on the 29th of May, never heard from him to ask my ?'s. I am so sick of WF, I told my loan officer she was great I would share her name if she ever leaves WF. I will not recommend them at all. I can't advertise for new enrollment as long as I don't know if I get to keep my home. So I don't get to try and increase my income.

On one occassion when I called, they transfered my call to the loan modification department...the gentleman who answered was very angry because he had been receiving calls all day and was not affiliated with WF and lived in Canada. Initially I tried to refinance the mortgage loan with a local WF office. Two days later I received a notice in the mail that our car loan had been turned down by WF. Although my husband is blind, his sense of smell is pretty good...he said he could "smell my hair on fire"....If they turned down a car loan we had not asked for, who authorized the credit check and whose credit did they check?

[madresmustang]

Originally Posted by jallen

Just as soon as I finished my post yesterday the loan negoitator called me and said that now I qualified for the modification.

She re-ran the program, and again said sometimes it makes errors and apparently it had...while she was explaining the steps in the modification, I could tell she was a little annoyed. It was like she was performing a chore she did not what to do.

At the end of our conversation, she said they would be sending out the paperwork next Wednesday via UPS. So we will see if that actually goes as planned and the terms are exactly as she described them during our conversation.

She mentioned that over the next few years I will have to submitt additional financial statements/hardship letters and that I would be on a 90 day trial period.

With all the mix-ups, inaccurate information and errors, I still wonder why this is being made so difficult for people who really need help. There should be sometype of oversight board on their side...they don't seem to understand what it is like to be on our side of the fence.

Of the 100's of times that I called, no one ever mentioned the executive offices....only told me I could not speak to the loan negioators....I did speak to several supervisors...but nothing...just nothing...

I keep reading back through the posts, and it is so confusing because I thought the whole purpose of a loss mitigation/loan modification was because people who have faced life changing events were/are facing deficits.

I am awaiting a re-run of the programs to. After my former loan officer (client of my child care) faxed over the financial documents (profit/loss, hardship and budget) to the Exec. Office he told her he'd see if I did qualify with the accurate information. Frustration is they didn't ask for them 3months ago and would communicate with me. I only found the Exec # here to normal customer service was worthless they had no info except what was on their current computer screen. All I ever heard was "it's being reviewed", I'd ask what's being reviewed they don't have my financial docs yet.

Now from my previous posting I stated they sent me Truth in Lending docs for the 2nd loan. The issue I had was that the dates stated were to late and that was the second time they sent them, I didn't get the first ones. So if UPS doesn't deliver on Wed. get on the phone immediately. Also read all the return date stuff to, the person I was working with assumed my case was closed as soon as he sent those docs to me. So when I had 2 questions to be answered before signing I never heard back from him that was 2 weeks ago and here I still sit.

I will say though I haven't had anyone there be rude of abrupt with me, they just don't communicate with me the homeowner. Also I understand what your saying about life changes. I have lived in this same home for 18yrs. made the improvements paid the mortgage regularly until Feb. of this year. Communicated from the beginning with them that I don't want to lose my home, it is also my total income I would be losing. I would be displacing 8 families children as well.

Your doing good keep a close watch on them and keep up your communication they document everytime you call and what your talking with them about.

[madresmustang]

Originally Posted by burrito

I've been skimming through this site and starting to get the feeling that I won't qualify. My deficit is close to $3000 and I haven't been delinquent yet. I'm only in this situation because I've been laid off. All I need is job to say that the situation is improving. However, I've been job hunting for the past 8 months without an offer(not even being picky anymore) and I don't see the situation changing in the next 6 to 12 months.

I also have unemployment benefit and savings that would keep me afloat for next 5mo or so. Then, onto stocks, 401k and such. Then I'll be flat broke.

With that, why would WF approve an adjustment?

Any thoughts on this? Is it even worth the effort with the odds? I might as well use the time to look for work, perhaps.

BTW, When WF (supposedly) mailed the form to me 2 weeks ago, but it got lost--I never recieved it. Of all the mail transactions I've done in my life time, I know of only 2 cases of "lost mail." Both cases very important and urgent. WF being one of them. Is this one of their tricks that banks do?

If WF sent you docs. they should have it on their computer system. They showed sending me docs to, but it was through UPS. When UPS didn't send them delivery notice that was on the system to they keep tracking records. If you were supposed to get them UPS call them and tell them to check their records and you want the tracking number to follow up with.

As for not being behind, they may try to refi you at a lower interest rate or they may do like they did to me with telling me anything. They just refused to take a payment not any $$ and I read where others sent $$ and WF sent it back to them. So then they put you into foreclosure so you will qualify for some type of help. After 2.5 months I finally was told that they had to do that so I could qualify for the Gov. Stimulus Program.

On this site many people have written about naca.org/refianance and I am looking into this if Exec. Office doesn't communicate better I'm now at 90days and still waiting. Remeber your 401k doesn't look the same anymore and you'll take a big penalty hit taking money out early. Usually not worth doing that. While you wait to confirm and reorder paperwork from WF put together your budget, and a hardship letter for them and on their website they have a Hope Now link to comsumer credit counceling it's where they started me. I don't know why they didn't do anything except tell me to cut my grocery bill and talk with my mortgage lender (ok already did that).

Good Luck I'll say a prayer for you like I am all the others who are facing these humbling situations. Don't give up hope

[jallen]

Hi. I don't think any of us are giving up hope, we are just really getting frustrated with the crapola....can I say that and not get into trouble???? .............

[madresmustang]

Frustration is definitely the word, I don't know why they didnt train employees to be in each branch so this could be done face to face. I think a lot of the problems would be gone or easily corrected.

I told my parent who is a WF loan officer, this is hurting my business to. I can't advertise any slots that I have available since I dont know if they are going to work with me. I don't want to enroll new children and then have to turn their lives upside down again. So I also can't increase my income, which might hurt me as well if they don't feel I make enough to make the payments.

I have read in posts where people were given a Forebearance period. I wasn't given that or told that was a possibility. It's hard for me to move forward, pay bills I have and it messed my credit score up so the credit cards (2) raised my interest rate and dbl. my payments now. Even though they were paid faithfully all the months.

[jallen]

Originally Posted by madresmustang

Frustration is definitely the word, I don't know why they didnt train employees to be in each branch so this could be done face to face. I think a lot of the problems would be gone or easily corrected.

I told my parent who is a WF loan officer, this is hurting my business to. I can't advertise any slots that I have available since I dont know if they are going to work with me. I don't want to enroll new children and then have to turn their lives upside down again. So I also can't increase my income, which might hurt me as well if they don't feel I make enough to make the payments.

I have read in posts where people were given a Forebearance period. I wasn't given that or told that was a possibility. It's hard for me to move forward, pay bills I have and it messed my credit score up so the credit cards (2) raised my interest rate and dbl. my payments now. Even though they were paid faithfully all the months.

I am sure you already have talked to the credit card companies, but you might want to try again. That is in my plan for this week.

[dcguy]

Hi All -

My loan mod application was denied couple of weeks back and when I logged on to the wellsfargo.com/assist website it used to show message saying that "MY loan application has been denied". I have sent all the paperwork again (after modifying our expenses) .... I have faxed these documents to Executive team first (06/12) and waited for a while and then faxed thesed documents to the wells fargo regulat fax number.

Today when I check my status on wellsfargo.com/assist it shows the following message:
"YOUR work out agreement is completed"

Does anybody know what this means. My guess is that they are talking about my first application which was denied ... but not sure. Please comment if anybody went thru the same situation.

Thanks in advance.

[Evan Bedard]

Hi Dcguy,


Maybe this means that your workout application has been completed but i'm not positive... You should give Wells Fargo a call when you get a chance and see what they have to say.

[jallen]

I received the loss mitigation paperwork as promised. They are calling for a loan payment on 7/15. I just paid the July payment on time, plus the paperwork explains that we will be reported for late payments during the trial period. How can that be when I have never made a payment late?

If I make the trial period payments on time...why would this be reported? That is the whole purpose for going through this...to not make late payments.

I will do and send in everything they are requiring me to do...but I am really skeptical of this whole deal. <O</O

[waitingpatiently]

Hi Jallen,

Did WF offer you the Making Home Affordable Modification? That's what I got offered, and though I'm thrilled with the new payment - the paperwork does say that during the 3 month "trial" period they will report to credit agencies that we are "late" even if we pay the trial payment on time...I'm not very happy about that at all! I haven't called the ERT dept. to discuss this part of the modification.

I've never been late, and the whole purpose of the modification was to save my home, and keep my A+ credit score...the paperwork also says after the 3 trial payments are made and the modification is permanent they will report to credit agencies that our loan has been modified and current. So I'm wondering what the "modified" hit on my credit report will do to our credit?

Did you also get the Making Home Affordable Mod? Congrats on getting a mod. that's something to be happy about right? I'm thrilled our payments went down $1000!~

[waitingpatiently]

Jallen,

Oh! I noticed you talked to your CC's this week. How did that go? I have 1 CC that is pretty large amount of debt with Citi...were you able to work with them? If so, what did you tell them? Did they help you?

[madresmustang]

Okay so three items.

First, how have you spoken with CC to get them to work something out? That maybe something I need to do soon, since the mess with WF tanked my CS and CC comps. raised interest rate doubling payments.

Jallen does your paperwork state whether this is a forebearance or modification? Since March 19 when I contacted them about 1 payment I would be behind on they have refused to accept any payments to date. I wonder why they have been allowing them from some of us, but not all.

Jallen and Waitingpatiently, don't worry about the late on your credit score be happy this is getting worked out for you. Your score will go back up quickly and will only be needed if your planning to make a purchase on credit or get a new CC. I'm still sitting here and now it seems that they never did anything with the information I gave 3 or more times a week.

I glade to see that the payments are working out for Waitingpatiently and they will work for you to Jallen. I have to work on not looking to far forward at this point, I'm stuck until WF gets something straightened out. I've thought about taking some legal action on the forced foreclosure.

[jallen]

Hey all,
I will get back to you once I have finished figuring all this out...I have spent the weekend, working on a flood issue in the basement, the dishwasher burning out, paying bills, cutting the grass and assorted other chores....I did not get in touch with the credit card people this week because work was so hectic...so that is still on my list of things to do...I so appreciate everyones feedback...I will be reviewing everything this week...

[jramberg]

I have a question. We figuring your DTI ratio, are you supposed to figure in your current mortgage payment?
I called the Exec. Dept today because I was frustrated from talking to LM yesterday. They did not even have my numbers right and had my income off by 2000.00/mo giving me a 2000 per month deficit.
Exec dept ran over the numbers that were now correct and at the end she asked where I had gotten their exec number from that they had been receiving many, many calls these days.
Jeannie

[tomser]

please tell me a bit detail how you got 2000 off ncome . i just am going to semd my lm doc today

[madresmustang]

I didn't add the current mortgage payment as they already had that information. I'm glad to hear that they are getting back to some people. What's funny is a forebearance or modification is supposed to be there for the purpose to allow families to keep their homes and still pay the mortgage. They can give a time line for the changes, but still help. I don't know about the California thing though I've read a lot of write ups from Californians who are in foreclosure.

My loan is insured through Freddie/Fannie because I'm a single parent and self-employed. My credit was excellent 720 before the down turn in economy and my income was more than enough to qualify for the loan. They required the ins. for times like this that happened 1.5yrs after I refied with WF.


I was asked about exec # info to, I told them I "googled" it and now I can "bing" it wasn't going to get anyone on this site to stop us helping each other.

[madresmustang]

Yes that is supposed to mean they have gotten the review done and they are supposed to contact you about the findings. If they have found a modification program or another way like a 2nd low interest loan to get current with them they will send paperwork through UPS. Of course UPS won't be delivering over the weekend.

Again I have seen write ups where this has happened. Not for me I'm still back in review that started on March 19th of this yr. Supposed to be no later than 90days sorry to say it not so.