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Learn How to Get a Loan Modification From Your Lender

Discussion in 'Loan Modification' started by Moe, Sep 20, 2007.

  1. Moe

    Moe Call 1-800-779-4547 Staff Member Loan Safe Mortgage

    A loan workout is an agreement that is negotiated with your current lender that changes the terms of your current loan. Lenders are willing to negotiate when borrowers are facing financial difficulties and can't obtain other financing alternatives. You must show the lender why it would be in the lender's best interest to agree to a workout arrangement. If convinced, a lender may be willing to reduce the loan interest rate, reduce monthly payment amounts or change other loan terms.

    A loan modification generally occurs where the parties to a problem loan mutually agree to workout the problem by creating new and better loan terms. The hope is that the new loan will enable to the borrower to meet their obligations.

    When applying for a loan modification, make a game plan on how exactly you are going to approach them. These people are trained in minimizing loss for their company and they get paid to by getting the most amount of money out of you as possible or declare that your case is un workable and foreclose on you. That is how they mitigate loss. If you understand this, then you'll know that you have to approach them and all conversations very carefully. Everything can and will be used against you.

    Items You Will Need When Applying For a Loan Modification

    Document income and expenses. Keep all correspondence (even the envelopes) Before negotiating a deal, gather all the information you need, starting with any correspondence from your lender. That includes anything that you have unopened from the lender. Don't throw away envelopes from the servicer -- postmarks sometimes can make the difference between being eligible or ineligible for relief.

    Collect everything that relates to income and expenses. Find your last four pay stubs. They want to see at least one month of income. If your income is very sporadic, the support your story by showing how you're getting paid so we can calculate an average over time. Gather at least three years worth of W2s and tax returns, plus three to six months of bank statements. Find all the mortgage paperwork and add that to the file. Pull together all bills, paid or not, from the times you were falling behind on the house payments until now. Include utilities, auto payments, credit cards, student loans, child support, medical bills. Find the winter and summer heating and cooling bills. You need to also include everything that documents why you fell behind. An employer's notification of reduced hours or a layoff, an invoice for an auto repair or a furnace replacement, a shutoff notice from a utility.

    What to Do When You Call Your Lender:

    Your lender has two platoons of employees who talk with delinquent borrowers. The first is the collections department, which consists of people who try to pry money out of you and get you current on the payments. The second group consists of the loss mitigation specialists. These departments go by different names, depending on the servicer, including foreclosure prevention, loan resolution and delinquency customer service. We'll use the most common name for the department: loss mitigation, or loss mit. It can be difficult to get through to the loss mitigation department if collection agents are discouraged from transferring calls. This is one of the benefits of having a helper, such as an attorney or a housing counselor. The first will intimidate bill collectors and the second might have contacts within the loss mitigation department.

    The trick with any bank and getting a work out done is learning to navigate their phone system so as to increase your chances of getting a live person. Over the years I’ve learned some tricks that help, sometimes you hear options that you know will lead to a person like when it says "to speak to a representative press ___" but sometimes they don't give you these options. So, you have to think, what options WOULD get a live person. For example often anything that involves new clients signing up will get a live representative...because they always want new business. You have to be a little savvy though; you can’t just tell the sales guy you called them so you could get a warm body to answer the phone!

    Once you get a live person, you want to be working your way up to a decision maker. This is sometimes harder to do for a homeowner than a 3rd party. Often with the homeowner they get stonewalled at the first level, and sadly the first tier in Loss Mitigation is really a glorified collections department. They are paid hourly employee's who have very little if not zero motivation to go the extra mile and help you get some needed comfort and relief while resolving your problem. Often they just compound the problem by being rude and demanding, telling people things like "just pay your bills". So it’s essential that you get beyond these people and to a specialist.

    Sometimes to get to this point you have to put up with the hourly employee's through a process of filling out their forms and information. Providing them with items such as pay stubs, tax returns and a whole host of financial information. Once everything is provided, then some lenders will assign the file to someone higher up in the loss mitigation department.

    The MOST crucial element to this whole process is your Budget and if you have done your due diligence, you'll be ready . They will ask you for a detailed list of your monthly expenses. If it’s too tight, you may not get approved, if you have too much extra income you are going to have an outrageous payment plan. Don't agree to it!

    The 2nd MOST important thing you can do is DO NOT SPEND YOUR HOUSE PAYMENTS. Often people stop making their payment because they are falling behind on other bills, or they can’t quite make the whole house payment. Over the years more often than not, the people I met with still have an income coming in each month, they just can’t meet all their obligations, so while the house is falling behind they take advantage of the fact that they aren't paying the house payment in order to catch up on other debts. THIS IS NOT WISE AT ALL. Sock away as much of that money each month as you can. Its crucial, here's why;

    If you don't pay your mortgage for 3-4 months and your lender decides to negotiate a repayment plan or a loan modification, then they will want what is called "good faith" money for you to come to the table with. Typically this is from 30-75% and sometimes 100% of what you owe in delinquent fees and attorney fees. Often I speak with homeowners who spend all their money and have nothing to work with. If that is the case, then don't expect them to work with you or you better have a REAAAALLLY good explanation and proof as to why you have no money to bring to the table.

    We all know life throws curve balls at us, it’s the nature of the game, and you’d better just expect it, because it’s coming in one form or another. Whether it be a car breaking down, an illness, injury or death. An accident in a car, you just don't ever know and it’s ALWAYS a good idea to have a rainy day fund. The crazy thing about going into foreclosure is that you can actually come out of it better off than you went in sometimes.

    Is it Better to Just Walk Away and Start Over?

    Many homeowners are just in over their heads. Many they love their home and their family does too. But what good is it when you are so stressed out that you cannot enjoy your home. You’re maxed out and you don't have a dime to take the kids for an ice cream or the movies. That's no way to live. This is a serious time to really sit down and see if it's all really worth the stress and heart ache. If it's not then maybe it's time to just throw in the towel and down size. Get something you can afford and enjoy. Just close the door on this time in your life and move on. Sure, it will affect you for years, but place your health and well being before making a house payment. If this is you, you're not alone. Think about it. Is it all really worth the pain and stress? You're already down, maybe it's time to just move on and take that money and get a nice little place to rent and regroup.

    By saving up your payment for 2-3 months or more depending on the foreclosure time line in your state, you can not only have enough to put together a really nice plan with your lender, but also have some in the bank for a rainy day or worse case scenario, a rental. Often payment plans with the bank can be pricey and very short terms, like 6 months total to repay what you fell behind on. The people if have worked with who took my advice to save up and keep some funds in the bank, were successful 100% of the time at keeping their home. Because they were prepared for life's curve balls. Even though they had fallen behind in the past, if they had an expense one month, they just pulled a little from the slush fund in the bank to help supplement their house payment that month.

    The Lender Has Made You a Deal, What Now?

    Respond to your lender, but don't be rushed into making a promise that you can't keep. Before making a deal with your lender, describe your situation to an attorney, accountant or a knowledgeable mortgage person. You need to make sure that it is reasonable and not an agreement that will stop foreclosure for a month or two.

    Many lenders are likely to offer forbearance. Theses are only good for a short term band aid and not for the long term. Most commonly, this entails adding a set amount to each month's payment. A forbearance plan can go as long as 36 months. But many are set to fail and are completely unreasonable for borrowers to pay back. Usually this will require placing the delinquent amount on top of your monthly mortgage payment. If you had trouble making your mortgage payment before, good luck paying your new larger more unaffordable payment.

    If all else fails, seek out a third party to handle this for you. There are many non-profit housing counselors, attorneys and for profits that are very experienced in loan modifications and loan workouts.

    Plan to arrive at an agreement, but prepare for the unwelcome news that you'll have to move out. If you turn over the deed in lieu of foreclosure, or agree to a short sale (in which the lender lets you sell the house for less than the mortgage balance), or are forced out in a foreclosure action, you'll need to consult a lawyer and maybe an accountant.

    Don't give up and fight to stop foreclosure and save your home! If all efforts fail, it's not the end of the world. Just make sure that you mitigate loss to you and do your best to save what little credit you have left.

    Good Luck!

    MRCHASE Guest

    As for what you should say in your letter, this is what I write for people. Feel free to use it:

    To whom it may concern:

    My name is______ and my loan number is ________. My loan was originated/closed on _________ by ________ for your firm. Under those terms at that time, I had a rate of ______ which was fixed for ________months. During that time we had some changes to our situation which has now called for this loan to be modified in order to keep our payments current and our loan with your firm in good standing. Under our current terms our Principle and Interest payment is________ which is completely affordable by our family with respect to our income and secondary credit obligations. My intent is to keep our payment at this amount or within no more than a $________ increase. We wish to fix this payment for a term of 360 months and the rate that accompanys this change we also wish to be fixed for that time period. We are willing to submit any and all income documentation showing our ability to repay under this request. We wish to have all of our current payments be credited to our current mortgage and be considered for our modification as payments under the new agreement. This is to ensure that our credit rating does not suffer due to non-reporting of good payment history.

    Please contact me immediately upon reciept of this letter regarding this matter, and please know that we wish to resolve this matter as quickly and efficiently as possible. If there is a direct person for contact in regards to our request, please include that in your response.

    I thank you for your understanding in this difficult time and trust that we will be able to reach an amicable and prosperous solution for all parties invovled. Again thank you and to the reciepient of this message, have a wonderful day.
  3. workinlossmit

    workinlossmit Chase Loan Modification Guide

    Chase has come out with a new process that will start in December.... go figure...

    Along with much of your frustration.. (real) loss mitigation specialist were having a hard time weaving their way through the jungles that we call the "workout" world.

    the workout world are people---workout specialist, underwriter, workout supervisor and the investor.

    in order for us to process a modification, we (loss mitigators) had to trust that the modification docs would be received at our offices in san diego... that is where the workout specialist work. so we never really knew if the docs were truly received or not.
    so, we waited (just like the borrower) for confirmation from the workout specialist that the docs were received. sometimes they would note it within 3-5 business days.. sometimes never.. so imagine 50 calls a day asking for status of mod from borrowers.. and the chagrin of saying over and over.. i dont see it noted on your acct that the docs were recvd. *sigh*

    well finally we have started a new way.. (im calling it cradle to grave).... mod docs are now going to be sent to the mitigaters own fax number and wherever they are and they will then post that theyve received the docs and then forward those docs to the workout specialist and receive a reply that the docs were received. if we dont receive confirmation from the workout specialist that docs are received then we can continue to forward them to the rep. so, it keeps us (loss mitigators) in the know. and keeps us from looking stupid half the time.

    and now a sympathy moment... loss mitigators work 250-300 assigned accounts a month *sniff* not everyone of our accts is going to be a mod acct... some will be referred for other workouts.... full reinstatments, repayment plans, short sales, full payoffs and deed in lieu's... everyone of our borrowers who is asking for information, deserves 100% satisfaction.... honestly... i give 100%, but i do make mistakes... my workout specialist makes mistakes.. and all the others who work in this line of business make mistakes.. my plea is not for sympathy.. but for an understanding.. be nice to your loss mitigation account manager.. if you want to keep your home... these men and women who work 8 hours a day work for you... and they empathize with your situation... and dont think for a second that all of us are bad.. some of us do have bad days... and we may take it out on you... and some of you may be having a hell of a bad day... because of your current plight.. just dont take it out on us.. cus ultimately.. the loss mitigation specialist, account manager, has control of your loan... and they do have some pull.

    good luck to all of you.... i sincerely mean that. it sucks that your in the position your in.. and with a belief in relying on others here on moe's and others sites you can save your home if you work with your servicer... NOT WITH FAUX loss mitigators.. why give them money??? makes no sense.. i ll save that issue for another time!!!!
  4. Moe

    Moe Call 1-800-779-4547 Staff Member Loan Safe Mortgage

    Thanks for the contributions Loss Mit. You have learned that I like people to pay it forward and you have done that, plus some.

    I would like for you to call me when you get a chance at 951-271-6283. I would like to discuss some opportunities that I have brewing and we can maybe use a guy like you on our team.
  5. mom23

    mom23 LoanSafe Member

    Dear Loss Mit and Moe-
    We are in the Notice of Rights phase. Do you have helpful information about the Chase in San Diego? I am not sure who my Loss Mit person is but I do know "Gary" gave me his personal fax and promised to walk it over to Loan Modification. I haven't been able to confirm receipt of this - any suggestions tips pointers? What type of income requirements help qualify - over the amount under the amount ? With our new adjustment we are short $340 per month what do underwriters want? look for? I feel like this forum is a godsend and hope that I am able to keep my home for my family.
  6. What-a-year

    What-a-year LoanSafe Member

    I spoke to some representative at countrywide and agreed verbally to a goodfaith of $8000 on $17 000 owed and rest reworked into balance. I seperated from spouse and wish to now foot the mortgage on my own.

    1) Because I am now footing this alone what is the best strategy to get bank to lower amount owed from $402K to say $350K. I know I may need to get past the first representatives to the real McCoys in loss mitigation. Is this possible?

    2)Over the phone I talked to a guy there (before I found this forum) and in pronciple agreed to $8000 good faith $ but did not get him to lower amount owed. Can I revise the numbers I ran with the rep because I found out that I cannot get a loan from my 401K in time due to divorce proceedings. I can only comfortably come up with $4000. I have not faxed anything to them as yet so nothing is written in stone (I hope).

    3) We have two properties. Wife and kids live in one and I live in the other(alone). Wife has been trying to short sale the property that I live in but is having no luck so I think the bank is aware and may want to work with me. We are due for mandatory settlement in 45 days but the load modification guys seem to want to move fast. My hope is to get a quitclaim from her and I do a quitclaim to her on the other property, then I want to go through with loan modification. I cannot go through the modification before the settlement in case I do not manage to keep the house. But having the paperwork at the settlement conference should help in negotiation and showing then that I have an ace up my sleeve. It seems the underling at countrywide wants to rush me with this modification and to get the $8000K out of me. The bank has send me a delinqent notice but I think have time because sell date cannot be set before late March, and settlemtn confernce is early March.

    Side more details/background:

    Going through divorce wife has attorney and I am self representing. In Jan 07 we had two properties with about $100K equity, and two trading accounts with $75K at highest value. Attorney and wife felt I deserve less than half of assets and they simply wanted to beat me down into some lopsided settlement as well as the fact that they were not sure which option gave the highest return (stocks were risky, but housing was weakening). I was willing to take cash or one house it did not matter.

    Fistly they froze the trading accounts including a cash trading account that had $38K including 30% margin. Total market value flactuated from Jan to June 07 to as high as $75K on May 31st. Freezing accounts was so that I fall deliquent on mortgages and credit cards and panic into a settlement (Lost to them is that this being a community property state, they can come after her for my debts).

    Things went by so fast from February 07 to June 07 and before long we were under water. Stocks reached highest value on May 31st but I could not sell the stocks because accounts were frozen. Went to court three times to try and get the account unfrozen, but they refused to budge. Then subprime and credit crunch hit and trading account went down to $15000 by end of June.

    Wife was upset with attorney and how things had went from bad to worse. They separetd for a brief moment and in that window I set court date and got account unfrozen and split equally the remaining cash.

    Back in Jan 07 homes could have been sold for a net gain of $100K, but again they were not interested in settlement (attorney wanted to rack in some $$ I suppose). By June the homes were under water as far as quick sale was concerned and after realtor commisions.

    Wife did a modification with one property that she and the kids are in, but I still am on title. Wife wants to short sale other property (that I am living in) for no gain just to spite me. I am interested in doing a modification on the second property and we do quitclaims to uncouple title. But wife cannot stand the idea of me retaining anything despite the fact that I was the one working while she was at home due to complicated pregnancies.
  7. JacMac

    JacMac Successful Homeowner

    Sorry to hear about your struggles. Sounds like you're getting the short end of a bad deal -- no advice but some support :)
  8. Tom H

    Tom H LoanSafe Member


    This sounds like a forebearance and not a loan modification. Banks are not apt to writedowns. I saw an article that came out on BankRate.com just a day or two ago irt Short Refinances. You certainly have your hands full and need some assistance. What is the interest rate on your loan(s)? If it is above market rate (or even at it) you can see if you can qualify for a loan modification. A lower interest rate generally means a lower payment, whereas a forebearance generally increases your payment to make up for what's in arrears. With regards to having the balance reduced, or forgiven, the only real way you'll see that happen most likely is in the case of a short sale. Otherwise, everyone with a mortgage would be calling their lender for instant equity. I think it's a great idea also, but from the bank's perspective this would be bad business. I don't mean to discourage you, but those are the facts. Here is a link to the article I was referring to, in case you'd like to read over it.

    Best of luck,


  9. What-a-year

    What-a-year LoanSafe Member

    Thank you all. Indeed expecting a loan reduction was a long shot, but I do feel that the ultimate value for a property is what investors pay for (rental value) and the reduction I was targeting is close to rental value. In fact why not have a clause in all loans that if you cannot pay the mortgae at least pay the fair rental value until bank can sell property. The banks would have much smaller losses. But again banks will find ways to screw things up due to greed.

    As for what the current rate was, is around 6%, but if I delay till after the 31st and Bernankey knocks off 0.5% I may have a few more dollar to spare.

    Another angle is to submit a decline in value application to the tax assessors office so that they can lower my taxes as per proposition 8 (California). Current tax bill says property is at $575K but I found two comps that sold in Nov and Dec 07 for under $400K, and with a weak market I probably will get a huge Tax decrease. Had a realtor run a comparative market analysis today.
  10. Tom H

    Tom H LoanSafe Member

    I hear you, and certainly can't say that I disagree with your logic.

    Perhaps things will change in the near future - but it all depends on how long you can wait it out before you have to take action. SoCal is a real tricky place to play this game. If home values go down 20% here (as predicted) that's a lot of negative equity to hang on to, and you most likely won't see it re-emerge for five years or more.

    I don't see many folks wanting to hang on to it, but I could be wrong. We'll see where the dust settles, but for now - no one's playing that kind of ball; at least not that I've seen anyway. I hope you can find a workable solution for your situation. Keep plugging at it, follow the advice you find in the stories here from others, and best of luck to you.

  11. treegirl

    treegirl LoanSafe Member

    Re: Learn How to Get a Loan Modification From Your

    Hi Moe, you have been doing some great work out there. I have been watching you for a few months now and I am very impressed.
    Here's the situation: We had one of those 2 year interest only loans on our 420,000 home. It started at 5.25 and thinking we could refi it sounded great! Well when it came time our house didn't appraise for bought value and it jumped to 8.25 in june. We still made payments on time and wrote a letter of hardship and sent documents to countywides home retention dept. on Sept. 29th, 2007. After struggling to pay for the high interest rate and never hearing anything from countrywide it jumped again after 6 months to 9.25. Now we had made the payments until it jumped again but we just couldn't do it at 9.25. Countrywide finally came back to us today with a 5 year 8.25 interest rate and we just coulnd't believe it? How does that help? We had cashed in on our retirement to pay for the first increase in interest rate? Any suggestions?
  12. Moe

    Moe Call 1-800-779-4547 Staff Member Loan Safe Mortgage

    Re: Learn How to Get a Loan Modification From Your

    Hi Treegirl,
    Welcome to the forum......so happy you joined.
    Can you please put your post under the Tell us your Story part of the forum so it won't be missed and then we will be able to assess your situation and give you some help.....
  13. JacMac

    JacMac Successful Homeowner

    Re: Learn How to Get a Loan Modification From Your

    I'm goint to seperate the posts into their own thread, including this one. Treegirl, look for it under the heading: Will Countrywide's Five Year Freeze Help" in the Country Wide Home Loans section of the forum.
  14. janicem

    janicem LoanSafe Member

    As a loss mitigation professional, can you tell me what is the criteria lenders use to determine if someone qualifies for a loan modification versus a temporary forbearance or determining that a mortgagee simply can't afford their home anymore? For example, is a lender more likely to determine that a modification is warranted if a loss of income or a new expense is permanent or temporary? Any thoughts you have would be very helpful -- even if you can just point me online to some other information.

    In addition, I did see an article online that states the FHA requires commercial lenders to try to avoid foreclosure through loan modifications, etc. (see below). How far does the lender have to go in these attempts? Is the difficulty one encounters in getting responses, documents from the lender due in anyway to this obligation? For example, for several months, Wells Fargo has been saying I'm to receive some "paperwork" but in the meantime, I've received nothing, not even my regular monthly statements, and this is impacting my credit report. I'm guess I'm asking if WF would stall purposely to put me in a worse financial situation?

    Part of Online Article:

    The Federal Housing Administration, which insures loans from a list of pre-approved commercial lenders, has mandated since the late 1990s that all its lenders follow strict loss mitigation protocols. If a borrower begins to default, lenders must make direct contact and offer to waive fees, reduce interest rates or fix them, apply partial payments to the amount owed, and come out with a loan modification that keeps the borrower in the home. Foreclosure proceedings are allowed only after all other options have been exhausted. It's a proven strategy and one that has made FHA-backed loans among the most coveted in the country.

    Commercial lenders, however, have been scrambling to assemble loss mitigation departments. And even when they do, nothing is mandatory, and the small staffs are poorly trained. The initiation of foreclosure filings remains at the discretion of the lender - a few days after default, or a few months - regardless of the borrower's condition or the lender's efforts. Actions that would alter the loan itself, like fixing or reducing interest rates, or waiving a portion of the principal balance, aren't usually considered.
    Instead, servicers often go the route of suspending monthly payments until a borrower regains financial footing or spreading out past-due payments over a period of months - things that do more to maximize a failing loan's cash flow than to help the debtor keep his or her home.
  15. Mary Salzer

    Mary Salzer Guest

    Each lender uses different criteria determined by the investor and type of loan, borrower circumstances and other relevant issues that either support or do not support the decision for mitigation and/or forbearance.

    You have a lot of questions that are germane to FHA only...and FHA standards as I responded in other post do not fit the bulk of the loans that we are dealing with here.

    FHA has their own very structured guidelines and manuals for this intervention and the lenders follow them per the requirements set forth in the manuals and guidelines, however where there is no value to the mitigation i.e. the borrower is over 4 months delinquent and is not employed, has no visible or apparent ability to be gainfully employed to provide the income required to support the loan, this does not pertain to issues that are extenuating or mitigating and outside of the borrower's control, there will be no mitigation. Additionally if there has been chronic disregard for the obligation again no mitigation. The loss mitigation that FHA preforms is really not modification..it is forbearance only, they will not drop rates. And they are not frankly the easiest to get to mitigate, as the lenders are only constrained to their guidelines in the mitigation process, which is really not all that liberal....the manuals are very vague and do not address the mitigation process as the post that you cited, as liberally as the person that wrote that post interprets them. FHA is not really that easy to work with unless there are compelling, extenuating and mitigating circumstances causing and underlying the default. They must, the lender act within 4 months to mitigate, if during that time the intervention does not work...then they will foreclose with no repercussions from FHA.
  16. Mary Salzer

    Mary Salzer Guest

    Now for the root of the issue, if you are with Wells Hell, yes they will stall, they will pull every trick in the book.....and they are pros, trust me, they are. So, you need to do the thing that I recommend...call, call, call and fax, fax, fax..be in their face. You must be proactive and treat this as a second job...they are not a really nice group of folks...

    Please do not assume that FHA will bail you out of Well's Hell, there will be no reform there. FHA is not able to control such a monolith of a corporation, Wells is perfectly capable of showing every effort to meet the spirit of the guidelines...you best bet is to call Well's Hell every day without fail and you can try FHA www.fha.gov for the HOC in your area and see if they can help (Home Ownership Center). However, you are in for a surprise, FHA is not all that proactive either, the issues are that they will not lower the rate, they will forbear only if there are compelling, extenuating circumstances beyond your control...and if you are less than 4 months delinquent.

    So stay very determined and very proactive...call HOPE 888.995.HOPE or ACORN ACORN: Home they too can try to intervene, but they will tell you to that Well's Hell is a difficult nut to crack.
  17. awsomeaaser

    awsomeaaser LoanSafe Member

    I would like to know if they assessed your taxes wrong on your morgage contract and if the appraisal was 30,000 more than the city assesment would be enough to prove preditor lending took place.
  18. pattona

    pattona LoanSafe Member

    Moe or Cat,

    When you fill out your Loss Mit paperwork how does the lender treat the income from rental property? In my package for my mom's Trust, I prepared a pro forma showing for the subject property; it can't be rented until I have some assurance that I have a deal. But the response to an ad I put in Craig's list was amazing so I am confident of my numbers. There will be a slight possitive.

    There is also a little rental property in my mom's Trust. It also has a slight positive cash flow.


  19. Moe

    Moe Call 1-800-779-4547 Staff Member Loan Safe Mortgage

    Each investor treats it differently.............some use averages and some use actual, just give them a call and see how they want you to list it......
  20. pattona

    pattona LoanSafe Member


    Sorry I wasn't clearer. What I need to know is whether they use 100% of the income or 75% like they do if you are applying for a loan.



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