Home Loans and Support

Green Tree Charge Off & Settlement

Discussion in 'Stop Foreclosure and Tell Us Your Story' started by philly19152, Nov 25, 2009.

  1. philly19152

    philly19152 LoanSafe Member

    Hello All,

    Ive been reading the forum non stop for the last week and appreciate everyones stories and input. I was hoping for some advise and from what I read, Green Tree is very difficult to deal with if not impossible which I seem to be experiencing.

    I had an 80/20 back in 2006, our first home. I went for 100% financing with a partial seller assist. Both loans were through National City, First was a 5/6 I/O @ 6.75% for $176K, the second for $44K which was a home equity @ 9.5% for 20 years.

    Due to some financial difficulties including medical expenses (I have a very high deductable, my 2 boys were sick with MCRA infections and required surgery, I still owe around $25K) and my DW loss of her job, I had difficulty making payments. I had submitted a request for assistance to National City through their website and uploaded the necessary documents, they indicated they did not have the docs, even though I was able to pull it off their site from my original submission. Still, I faxed over what they wanted and have confirmation. I called about every week for status and nothing, 2 months later, they told me they closed the file as they did not receive the required documents. Not much I could do except for to do it again, which I did. They denied the modification indicating there was a deficiency in income. Obviously thats the case, thats why I asked for the mod.

    So I try NACA. I fax over everything, finish the interview, send my docs (about 5 times) and nothing ever happened. When I called, they indicated they did not receive a response from my investor. I asked national city about HAMP and they told me the investor does not participate and would not tell me who that was. Nice. I missed 2 payments on my 80% mortgage, otherwise, I am back to paying it on time. They send me an occasional letter reminding me I am past due and its reporting late, even though I am making payments (not on the 2 months that were past due). I tried the mod once again since PNC bought them out and am hoping maybe they will look at it. I doubt they will proceed with foreclosure since I am now paying.

    On my second, during the mod, the transferred it to Green Tree. I never paid Green Tree. Its been 6 months now and am almost sure it had to be charged off. I spoke to a Nancy there, very rude, despite my efforts, she said they cannot due anything without 2 months of payments, good faith. I said no and left it at that. I wanted some sort of arrangement, I couldnt just pay 2 months and then have them keep after me for the 4 months and keep the 9.5% loan. Nancy called and left a message about an "exciting new program" I would qualify for. I bit and called and she explained that they can reduce my interest to 1 or 2% for 6 months. I explained that this is not a viable long term solution and she hung up. I never heard from them since.

    I believe my current home value is now $180-$190K, its tough to assess since there are some larger homes in my area that sell for more, since there bigger and it seems like sites like zillow are simply averaging out sale prices. Plus the city has a weird assessment value, I think the value of my home per the city is $26K (they have been trying to reform the bureau for years to fix this).

    My credits not an issue, I prefer living off cash now and a lot of my other debt has been charged off and I would like to work on settling them soon. I have heard of home owners being able to settle their 2nds for 5-20% which is great and glad for them. I would like to do the same but so far, I have found one who was able to settle without involving a shortsale or BK or foreclosure. Has anyone tried to settle a loan serviced by Greentree and if so, can they provide the process and amounts. I currently owe $43K on the second, $176K on the first which will never change since its an I/O.

    I would like to settle the 2nd, and mod the first after thats done.

    Also, I received a note from HOPE outside my door asking me to call National City. Im not sure if National had reported my late payments to them some time ago, but now Im really dealing with PNC and Greentree.

    Not sure what to do, kind of afraid to wait it out with Green Tree. If they charge it off, maybe Ill have better luck with the collection agency they send it to if any.

    The total purchase price of the home was $220K, still owe $219K overall but think the value is around $180-$190K, first lien is $176K, wonder if they would consider foreclosing since they may walk away with something nominal, but cant be much consider fees, expenses, etc. I live in PA which is recourse but have absolutely no assests and they cannot garnish my wages her and my bank account is usually tapped out after everything. I guess the only good part about PA.

    BK is really not an option for me since it would affect any future employment. It seems that employers dont mind the lates, but the BK will definitely make me unemployable in my field.

    Thanks in advance for any help. I appreciate it.
  2. philly19152

    philly19152 LoanSafe Member

    Sorry also wanted to ask, is there anyway I can verify if they still have the deed on this, between all the transfers, I wonder if they can produce the original note and if so, I would like to examine it, for both mortgages.

    PS: also have a gas lien of around $1K which the city put on my house after I missed a payment on an arrangement. I am current with the arrangement though.

    Sorry last thing, my loans are not through fannie, freddie or FHA. Not sure who actually, My DTI at the time of purchase was 49%, now thinking about it, it was a very bad idea. Thanks again.
  3. bloominga

    bloominga Banned

    Philly,
    Welcome and thanks for joining. You will find more information here than anywhere else on the internet for Loan Modifications, Foreclosures and many other topics.

    I have only one mortgage with Green Tree. They are ALMOST impossible to deal with but there is always hope. I will never say they are impossible. I don't know about the instance of a 2nd. I have sent a QWR (Qualified Written Request)to force them to produce all the documents pertaining to my mortgage including the note.

    Someone with more knowledge of the 2nd mortage can hopefully answer your questions about that.

    You can find the QWR form on a link in the Main Menu of the Forum. There may be other steps you should take for your scenario before you resort to the QWR.
  4. philly19152

    philly19152 LoanSafe Member

    Thank you bloominga, thank you for the QWR info, thats a good idea, Im starting to question what info they actually have since they seem to have purchased a lot of these in bulk. Lets see I guess.

    I would like to know if anyone has had any success in settling there second with them, Ive spent hours looking and can only really find 3 examples but all of them are related to a short sale, BK, etc.

    I appreciate it.
  5. philly19152

    philly19152 LoanSafe Member

    Selfish bump. Sorry.
  6. Housebroken13

    Housebroken13 LoanSafe Member

    I sent the a QWR, Here's the response I got:

    Green Tree is in receipt of your correspondence dated November 6,2009.
    The purpose of a qualified written request is to receive information, clarification or corrective action regarding problems and disputes with the servicing of a loan secured by a first lien mortgage.
    You are seeking information for a loan secured by a subordinate lien mortgage.Therefore, 12 USC §2605(e) does not apply to your loan serviced by Green Tree.

    Since this is not a proper qualified written request, Green Tree is not required to respond. As a courtesy, Green Tree will respond to your servicing questions within 60 business days.

    On May 1,2009, the servicing of your loan was transferred from xxxx to Green Tree. Green Tree neither originated nor owns your loan; it merely services it for third party. It can only provide information from May 1,2009 forward. Information requested which is not germane to the actual servicing of your account will not provided.

    Although 12 USC §2605(e) is not applicable to your correspondence, please be advised that a qualified written request is not the appropriate vehicle assert loan origination issues.

    What should my next step be?

    Based on the response something definitely smell funky with my loan. The fact that they are not complying also tells me they do not have all the proper loan documents. Especially my note.

    Any attorney I hire will have a field day with this explanation. They are definitely hiding something. I also requested a copy of the Note which they did not even mention, so I'm positive they do not have it. Thus they can not legally collect on the loan.
  7. SShouse

    SShouse LoanSafe Member

    I would call RESPA to get more information about what you can do. They say "it is not a proper qualified written request"... not that they cannot provide you with that information. They are very smart and they are going to do everything they can to avoid disclosing all that information.
    I don't have their phone number but I bet you can google it. Their address is

    Office of RESPA and <?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:smarttags" /><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:placeName w:st="on">Interstate</st1:placeName> <st1:placeType w:st="on">Land</st1:placeType></st1:place> Sales Office of Housing, Room 9146 US Department of Housing and Urban Development <st1:address w:st="on"><st1:Street w:st="on">451 Seventh Street, SW</st1:Street> <st1:City w:st="on">Washington</st1:City>, <st1:State w:st="on">DC</st1:State> <st1:postalCode w:st="on">20410</st1:postalCode></st1:address>

    Also maybe you should send your QWR to the original servicing company before your loan got transferred.
    In addition, in the letter they are letting you know that they are the third party servicing company. If they are bothering you with calls or threating you, you have the right to ask them to stop calling you and only contact you in writing. As a matter of fact that should be your prefered method since that way you can keep all the mail for your records (including envelopes with timestamp) sometimes they back-date letters to pretend they sent it to you much earlier. (losers)

    I am also going through the same on our second. I just got the first loan modified and I was trying to get my second either settled or modified. I haven't paid for the last three months. As soon as they started yelling, I realized negotiations will not be happening on the phone so I sent them my letter to cease all contact by phone.
    They cannot foreclosure on your property since they have a subordinate lien, your house is underwater so their loan is unsecured. They can wait until the market values go up again and they have enough equity to go after your house which it will not happen in the next couple of years (at least for me).
    You can start sending them your settlement offer and see what they say. Start low because they will counter-offer anyway.
    Hope it helps.
  8. SShouse

    SShouse LoanSafe Member

  9. Housebroken13

    Housebroken13 LoanSafe Member

    This is great info guys! Thanks very much RESPA will definitely be getting a letter from me, I will also send copies the originators of the loan as well and demand to know who the investor and who is the owner of this loan
  10. Housebroken13

    Housebroken13 LoanSafe Member

    I strongly suggest anyone dealing with these folks and thier abusive collection practices submit a letter and a complaint to the

    Federal Trade Commission
    Consumer Response Center
    600 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW
    Washington, DC 20580

    If they receive enough complaints about Green tree (and I know there are tons in the forums) They will investigate.
  11. michelle kaber

    michelle kaber LoanSafe Member

    hi,

    I also have green tree, originally national city. I'm trying to modify but their loss mitigation is telling me they DO NOT deal with 3rd parties(I have an attorney)Is this legal? I have an investment property with a Fannie Mae loan. Thanks....
  12. Housebroken13

    Housebroken13 LoanSafe Member

    Once you hire an attorney they are "your representative" Green Tree has no choice but to deal with them and not you. So yes it is an invalid statement on their part, and illegal, send a complaint to the FTC immediately!

    They are playing hardball because they don not own nor possess any of the notes that they are collecting debts on.
  13. michelle kaber

    michelle kaber LoanSafe Member

    thanks, that's what my attorney said. They will say anything, even lie. she said I need to respond within 48 hours, as well.

    I will send a complaint...
  14. philly19152

    philly19152 LoanSafe Member

    This is pretty interesting. Amazing, wonder were the note is. It sounds like they still will process your request but are trying to buy time. Let us know if they do respond or are able to produce, Im sure it would benefit a lot of people here.

    I think mine was finally charged off last week. Received a letter from a the collection division of Green Tree, under some other name here in PA telling me to remit payment to a different address and to pay $44K in full today :rolleyes:. Sure Green Tree, sure.

    Off to City Hall next to see who owns what.
  15. Housebroken13

    Housebroken13 LoanSafe Member

    philly - did you simply stop paying them? I keep trying to do that and i get harassing phone calls. I'd wish they would just write the damn thing off so it does go to collections!
  16. philly19152

    philly19152 LoanSafe Member

    I havent paid green tree since the loan was moved to them which was 05-01-2009.

    I changed my numbers a few times so I do not think they had a current number. I called in once and spoke to Nancy who was "so kind" to take my call, I didnt give her a number but she obviously had caller id since she called everyday since then. I tried to work with her but she explained she could not do anything until I made 2 "good faith" payments, I declined, I explained I wanted some sort of an agreement first. The last time she left a message around mid October with an exciting new program. I called her back and she explained the had a brand new program, no interest for 6 months. I explained I needed a long term solution, that wouldnt help, she then said whatever and hung up on me, never heard from her again.

    She previously indicated it would charge off in 180 days but it seems like it took longer than that and it seems to have moved to another department instead of an outside collection agency.

    Im sure theyll call soon. They always seem to find a way to get your number, in my case, I switched number 4 times in the past year since the robots called me 100 times a day, everytime I would pick up, they robot would just hang up. Very frustrating.

    Anyway, Im avoiding all of them, building a reserve and hoping I can settle everything out.

    Ill post with any new developments.
  17. danamac

    danamac LoanSafe Member

    Hi, I am new to this forum. Currently, we are trying to work something out with our first mortgage which is now with PNC. We are months behind because they told us they would not work with us as long as we are current. Well, guess what....now that we are behind, we are in foreclosure status and they still do not want to lower our monthly payments. The only thing they have done was postponed the bill of sale date on Jan. 5th, BUT we have to pay $ on the 15th and start back with our original monthly payments every month thereafter PLUS the late fees. WTF? This is not helping us at all!!!! We also have a second with Green Tree,which our attorney, is trying to get rid of that all together, but by the looks of these forums, they are impossible to work with???? What happens if it is just "written off??? What does that exactly mean and what does it do to your credit? (which ours used to be excellent until we got behind on house payments)
  18. auroraproblem

    auroraproblem LoanSafe Member

    Philly,

    I am by no way an expert, but have been dealing with a second mortgage for almost a year now. Currently we are in the same type of position as you, in the sense that we want to keep the home and are trying to settle on a second. We had to finally give up hope sadly; there was nothing Wells Fargo would do clear up to 20% offer for settlement, they completely blew us off. We went into charge off and this changed little their attitude.

    We are now in a Chapter 13 lien strip, which has now been approved by all parties. In the end they lost everything, despite knowing this was coming, it did not change their attitude.

    Your home is not under the second mortgage from what it looks like on your numbers (at least not a sure thing). For you to even consider BK you should have your second in a guarantee unsecured position or they are going to delay and contest.

    If you truly have some resources and can settle for as much as 20%, in my opinion I would let the loan go to charge off, contact the recovery department (usually what they call it) and let them know you can borrow 20% from family and friends within the next 3 months to settle the loan if they are game. Likely they will have you fax in the offer. They will also likely ask you for financial information, personally, if you are already after charge off I would refuse to send it. They do not need it if the account has already been written off the books.

    If they do not accept the offers, then your second choice can be to wait it out, eventually they may contact you again or sell it to someone else who may be more game. All of this of course assumes you have nothing to attach (no assets). If your money is in a bank account I would find another place for it.

    It is not going to be an easy road, but if you keep fighting the fight it is possible they will come to the table. Never use the numbers of value you have above though. If your first mortgage is 174k, then anytime you are talking with the 2nd you should be using a value of 160-165k. Be honest with yourself, the value they are looking for is a reasonable sell value (home will sell in 6 months at that price).

    Good luck.
  19. philly19152

    philly19152 LoanSafe Member

    Thanks aurora, I appreciate the input.

    So far I havent heard anything from Greentree since the charge off, not even receiving bills at this point. I still am paying my primary, but owe an additional 2 months from when I was behind early last year and they keep tacking on late fees. I want to resolve that soon, but want to hold on to as much money as possible for resolution of the possible 2nd.

    BK is the one thing I really wanted to avoid though its probably the best option for me. The only issue is that a BK would make it much more difficult in the future in case I need another job in my field. Im even ok with settling for 20%, just not getting anywhere yet with green tree. I am thinking to wait till months end and call from a hidden number to avoid the collection calls and see where it goes

    Dana, I feel for you, its been difficult and I am glad they stripped it via the chapter 13.

    Not sure why they would need any financials for the settlement though. I have the documents they need but dont understand why the need to see my bank statements though. Thats something Im not ok with though.

    loooooooooooong road ahead.
  20. dg008

    dg008 LoanSafe Member

    I've been working with Greentree also....Although even though I thought I was getting somewhere. I realize it's just wishful thinking. They started off strong, really strong and yes they track all the numbers you've ever called with to try and reach u. Google, Facebook the works. I offered a settlement for various reasons similar to everyone else. I am waiting for a negotiator to call me. They requested a payment to avoid charge off which I paid but honestly, I don't have any more money other than my settlement. I'm actually don't have that yet and hope they will give me a few days/weeks to come up with it all.

    If anyone does have luck with Greentree please post as we all our looking for options.

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