NACA Save the Dream tour - SUCCESS!!

[Brice D]

Where to start? And why oh why didn't I know there was a place like this before? (this is going to be LONG. Just thought I'd warn you)

I guess I'll start at the beginning. My wife and I moved to Arizona on February 1, 2003. The day the Shuttle Columbia was lost. I remember it well. It's all we could listen to on the AM radio in the moving truck.
We moved in a hurried fashion from Texas due to some family circumstances that I won't get in to. Suffice it to say, it was in her son's (my stepson) bet interest, and the only way to get away from the problem.

We moved in with my parents temporarily. At the time, I was 25, she was 22. We had to leave our home in Texas. We rented it for a while, until we could sell. Owning that property made it extremely difficult for us to get a mortgage. No one would lend us money with no current job history and a current home. We tried for several months, but nothing. In May of 03, we found a home that was a rent to own deal. It was in a neighborhood we loved, great location and schools, and had just been completely remodeled. The deal was we paid our monthly rent, $500 of which went into a sort of escrow account, for a down payment when it came time to buy. Either owner carry, or bring our own mortgage. It was a good deal. During that 2 years, we were able to sell the home in San Antonio, and build a job history. As our 2 years came up, we began searching for a mortgage lender.

We found a company called Argent Mortgage Corp (AMC). They were very nice and told us everything we wanted to hear. This was really the first time we had purchased a home. My wife had bought the house in Texas before we got married, and had used a state housing program, so she really didn't know anything about the process either. At any rate, AMC offered us a 5.25% ARM. That sounded great. They explained that it was an adjustable rate, but explained that with interest the way it was, our payments would actually go down when it adjusted! They also told us we could refinance with them in 2 years when the rate adjusted if we didn't like it. This was approx June 2005. We didn't know any better, and didn't do the research. Our Fault. We shouldn't have taken them at their word. We signed the papers and closed on our home! We were ecstatic. Until just a few months later (maybe only 1.5 months) we received notice that AMC had sold our loan to Countrywide. Hm?

We called Countrywide and talked to them about the refinance we were told we could get in 2 years. They pretty much laughed their butts off. Crap. Oh well, our rate was going to go down, right? Well, as you all know, that was bunk. In June '07, our payment went from ~$1100 to $1650. That hurt. Alot. But we made do. Around January 08, Pres. Bush did something that reversed the increase temporarily (I don't recall what the program was). This lowered our rate, and our new payment was ~$1380 per month, until January 2013, when it would go back to adjustable again. Whatever, it was nice saving the money.

Lo and behold, we find out my wife is pregnant with child #3 in February 08. She was on birth control and we already had a 9 y/o and a 6 y/o. This was a little bit of a shock. 3 kids was NOT in our plans. What are ya gonna do, right? She works for a small business and would not be paid for her maternity leave. We started scrounging and saving. I am self employed. Construction industry. As you all know, that industry took a huge hit about that time, and I lost a big percentage of my income. Made saving more difficult. We still planned to be OK. She was going to work until she had the baby, and take just 2 months off. Oops. She was ordered to bed rest at the beginning of August 08. Baby didn't come until October 20, 2008. With the loss of income on both ends, we made our last payment on the 1st of October. There just wasn't going to be a way to make one in November. I had already sold just about everything that wasn't bolted down to feed us and keep us afloat.

So, we called Countrywide on Oct 7, 2008 and told them what was going on. They said 'No problem. We'll put you in for a loan modification/workout. You'll get it. Don't worry about it!' Why oh WHY do I keep taking these people at their word. So, we made no payment in Nov, Dec, and Jan. They told us not to, that it would just be rolled in. No worries. My wife went back to work in the middle of January. By mid February, we had enough to make a payment. We called, and were told we couldn't make a 'real' payment, it had to go into a side account (suspense account, IIRC) until the mod was complete. No problem. We just wanted to make some headway. In March, we were told our modification was cancelled, but they couldn't tell us why. Coincidentally, this was right about when the BOA takeover of Countrywide happened. We resubmitted. Continued making payments, even though it was literally ramen for dinner many nights. We called just about every week. Always told the same thing. Keep waiting, keep waiting. So we did. We continued to make payments, but the late fees from 08 kept adding up. We were ~$8000 past due and getting no where. That has been our situation for the last year. Until Saturday October 3, 2009....

To be continued (might take me another hour to type it out)

[Brice D]

Ok, I'm back! I didn't realize that when you hit submit, it took several hours for the post to be approved. At that point, I had to go to bed! Just home from work now, so I'll finish up the story.

My wife heard about NACA. She didn't say much to me about it, just told me that we had to go down and meet with our lender who was going to be in town on Saturday. She knows me, she knows I can be a pessimist and would have looked too deep into NACA and found any failures and used that as an excuse to not waste a Saturday. Smart woman.

We arrived at the convention center at 6:45am. Doors opened at 9am and we went into an orientation. They talked about what NACA does and why they do it. Gave a run down of what our day would be like. This lasted about an hour. From there, they shuffled us upstairs to a waiting area. Here they went over what paperwork we should have, helped us fill out forms etc. Again, about an hour. Then shuffled to another waiting area. It was about 11am. We could see the counselors! So close! HAHAHAHA! We waited in this area until close to 7pm before we got in front of a counselor. To be honest, our counselor was no help at all. It was her first Home Save tour, and she didn't seem to be that interested, nor very knowledgeable.

First, came the hardship letter. She told us it was all wrong. We couldn't claim the ordered bed rest and unpaid leave as hardship. It wasn't permanent, so it didn't count. Are you kidding? This baby along with the downturn in the economy is what got us in this mess in the first place. She had us rewrite the letter leaving that out. Fine, whatever. I still had lost 40% of income, so we still had a hardship.

I am self employed. I am a one man show. Construction. This seemed to really stymie her. I brought 6 months of bank statements and a P&L. We went through all of our expenses and then our income. I had to fill out a worksheet for my self employment. Basically, all it was was business deposits - expenses = income. She entered everything then started running numbers. Lots of mmmmmms and oooohhs. We kept asking her what? She really wouldn't respond. We got down to it and she was having some trouble making the numbers work. However she wouldn't tell us what the problem was. Were we spending too much, or not enough? At one point I said 'Listen, if we have to cancel our cable tv or spend less on soda, whatever, what do you need us to do?' Her answer? "I don't know, you tell me." WTF? I don't even know what you need the numbers to be to have a clue what you need us to do. She finally called over a manager and they went over it, made some adjustments, and they were done. Or so we thought.

She went and got the printout of our numbers to take to the lender. WTF WTF WTF? She entered my business deposits as gross income. I am in construction. Most jobs I spend more than triple on materials than what I make. For our average gross combined income, she had entered a hair over $12,000, with a net of $4200. This made the HAMP $3800 or so. How the heck am I going to take that to my lender and tell them I can't afford $1400. They would have laughed me out of the building. At first I couldn't figure it out. I asked her how the heck are you showing we're paying $8000 in taxes every month? Then it dawned on me what she did. I told her it was wrong. My business deposits are not the same as gross income. My gross income is what is left over after expenses. My net is what is left after I pay self-employment taxes. She was very exasperated. I told her I wasn't leaving her table until she fixed it, even if it took all night.

She said she would be back, she had to talk to a manager. After a few minutes she came back and said she would change the gross, but it was going to take at least an hour, since it would change everything. I tried to explain that it would change absolutely nothing but the HAMP #. She couldn't understand, but got to work. After less than 5 minutes, she got up and said she'd be back. A few moments later she comes back with a new printout for the lender that is actually realistic. I said something along the lines of "I guess it didn't change anything after all, did it?". She just glared at me and told us to go sign in with the lender.

We made our way over to the lender table and signed in. We ran to the restroom, and by the time we came back, they were calling our name. It was now 7:45pm. We sat down with the BAC rep. She looked at our file and pretty much went all bug-eyed. Apparently we were the first people she had seen that had been in modification for so long, with absolutely NOTHING done on their end. We told her our story, how we'd been trying to work with them for a year and getting nowhere. Just being told to wait wait wait.

She asked to see our hardship letter and paperwork. After reading it, she asked why we hadn't put in the information about my wife being ordered bedrest, etc. Are you kidding? We told her what the NACA counselor had said, and she told us that that was ridiculous. In the end it didn't matter, but if our modification had to be approved by the investor, it could have made all the difference in the world. Moral here: don't let them talk you out of the truth.

She entered all kinds of stuff into her system. She then got excited, because of our investor. We have a private investor. It's not a bank, not the government, but a person. She couldn't tell us their name. She said she was excited because this person generally has a non-delegated (I think that's what she called it) status on their loans, which means that he/she must approve of all modifications personally. For whatever reason, she speculated because our excellent payment history prior to last year, and our continued payments even while in modification, our loan was delegated (again, I think that's the term she used). Which meant the bank was free to do what ever they wanted. Yipppeee!

She punched some more numbers and said "Well, do you want to hear what I was able to do for you?" Heck yes we did! Here's where we sat. We owed ~$16000 over the year, including late fees. We had ~$9000 in a suspense account, what was left after paying homeowners insurance and property taxes. So, we owed approx $8000 just to become even. Our PITI was ~$1372 a month with an 8.7% ARM. She rolled the $8k to the back of the loan, applied the money in suspense, and came back with our new loan. 3% percent fixed for the life of the loan. $940 PITI. HOLY COW!

What a weight lifted off our shoulders. Finally, we have resolution. After 1 year of struggling and fighting, its over. We get to keep our home, and we scored a great rate. Outstanding rate in fact.

So, that's my story. I hope it motivates some of you. Don't give up. Keep after them. NACA might be a little crazy, but it worked for us. It could work for you.

Good luck!

[Jillian118]

Did you sign off on permanent modification paperwork??

[kura52]

Originally Posted by Brice D

Ok, I'm back! I didn't realize that when you hit submit, it took several hours for the post to be approved. At that point, I had to go to bed! Just home from work now, so I'll finish up the story.

My wife heard about NACA. She didn't say much to me about it, just told me that we had to go down and meet with our lender who was going to be in town on Saturday. She knows me, she knows I can be a pessimist and would have looked too deep into NACA and found any failures and used that as an excuse to not waste a Saturday. Smart woman.

We arrived at the convention center at 6:45am. Doors opened at 9am and we went into an orientation. They talked about what NACA does and why they do it. Gave a run down of what our day would be like. This lasted about an hour. From there, they shuffled us upstairs to a waiting area. Here they went over what paperwork we should have, helped us fill out forms etc. Again, about an hour. Then shuffled to another waiting area. It was about 11am. We could see the counselors! So close! HAHAHAHA! We waited in this area until close to 7pm before we got in front of a counselor. To be honest, our counselor was no help at all. It was her first Home Save tour, and she didn't seem to be that interested, nor very knowledgeable.

First, came the hardship letter. She told us it was all wrong. We couldn't claim the ordered bed rest and unpaid leave as hardship. It wasn't permanent, so it didn't count. Are you kidding? This baby along with the downturn in the economy is what got us in this mess in the first place. She had us rewrite the letter leaving that out. Fine, whatever. I still had lost 40% of income, so we still had a hardship.

I am self employed. I am a one man show. Construction. This seemed to really stymie her. I brought 6 months of bank statements and a P&L. We went through all of our expenses and then our income. I had to fill out a worksheet for my self employment. Basically, all it was was business deposits - expenses = income. She entered everything then started running numbers. Lots of mmmmmms and oooohhs. We kept asking her what? She really wouldn't respond. We got down to it and she was having some trouble making the numbers work. However she wouldn't tell us what the problem was. Were we spending too much, or not enough? At one point I said 'Listen, if we have to cancel our cable tv or spend less on soda, whatever, what do you need us to do?' Her answer? "I don't know, you tell me." WTF? I don't even know what you need the numbers to be to have a clue what you need us to do. She finally called over a manager and they went over it, made some adjustments, and they were done. Or so we thought.

She went and got the printout of our numbers to take to the lender. WTF WTF WTF? She entered my business deposits as gross income. I am in construction. Most jobs I spend more than triple on materials than what I make. For our average gross combined income, she had entered a hair over $12,000, with a net of $4200. This made the HAMP $3800 or so. How the heck am I going to take that to my lender and tell them I can't afford $1400. They would have laughed me out of the building. At first I couldn't figure it out. I asked her how the heck are you showing we're paying $8000 in taxes every month? Then it dawned on me what she did. I told her it was wrong. My business deposits are not the same as gross income. My gross income is what is left over after expenses. My net is what is left after I pay self-employment taxes. She was very exasperated. I told her I wasn't leaving her table until she fixed it, even if it took all night.

She said she would be back, she had to talk to a manager. After a few minutes she came back and said she would change the gross, but it was going to take at least an hour, since it would change everything. I tried to explain that it would change absolutely nothing but the HAMP #. She couldn't understand, but got to work. After less than 5 minutes, she got up and said she'd be back. A few moments later she comes back with a new printout for the lender that is actually realistic. I said something along the lines of "I guess it didn't change anything after all, did it?". She just glared at me and told us to go sign in with the lender.

We made our way over to the lender table and signed in. We ran to the restroom, and by the time we came back, they were calling our name. It was now 7:45pm. We sat down with the BAC rep. She looked at our file and pretty much went all bug-eyed. Apparently we were the first people she had seen that had been in modification for so long, with absolutely NOTHING done on their end. We told her our story, how we'd been trying to work with them for a year and getting nowhere. Just being told to wait wait wait.

She asked to see our hardship letter and paperwork. After reading it, she asked why we hadn't put in the information about my wife being ordered bedrest, etc. Are you kidding? We told her what the NACA counselor had said, and she told us that that was ridiculous. In the end it didn't matter, but if our modification had to be approved by the investor, it could have made all the difference in the world. Moral here: don't let them talk you out of the truth.

She entered all kinds of stuff into her system. She then got excited, because of our investor. We have a private investor. It's not a bank, not the government, but a person. She couldn't tell us their name. She said she was excited because this person generally has a non-delegated (I think that's what she called it) status on their loans, which means that he/she must approve of all modifications personally. For whatever reason, she speculated because our excellent payment history prior to last year, and our continued payments even while in modification, our loan was delegated (again, I think that's the term she used). Which meant the bank was free to do what ever they wanted. Yipppeee!

She punched some more numbers and said "Well, do you want to hear what I was able to do for you?" Heck yes we did! Here's where we sat. We owed ~$16000 over the year, including late fees. We had ~$9000 in a suspense account, what was left after paying homeowners insurance and property taxes. So, we owed approx $8000 just to become even. Our PITI was ~$1372 a month with an 8.7% ARM. She rolled the $8k to the back of the loan, applied the money in suspense, and came back with our new loan. 3% percent fixed for the life of the loan. $940 PITI. HOLY COW!

What a weight lifted off our shoulders. Finally, we have resolution. After 1 year of struggling and fighting, its over. We get to keep our home, and we scored a great rate. Outstanding rate in fact.

So, that's my story. I hope it motivates some of you. Don't give up. Keep after them. NACA might be a little crazy, but it worked for us. It could work for you.

Good luck!

So awesome for you two!!!! Terrific news! Congrats!!!

[Brice D]

Originally Posted by Jillian118

Did you sign off on permanent modification paperwork??

At the event? No. You don't do it there.

I did, however, receive a package via FedEx yesterday morning that had the final paperwork to sign. Also, the bank website shows our modification status as approved.

Our payment is even less than we thought! $921.01 PITI, and our first payment isn't due until 12/1/09.

[townie271]

Congratulations !!!!!!!!

[SillyWorld]

Wow great story...Too Bad some of us are about at the end of Waiting..

CONGRATS BTW!!!