Feedback Needed - Is it OK to Let "Ethical" Mortgage Professionals Join Loan Safe?

[Moe Bedard]

Great Kimbly! All that education will help you in helping others. Awesome.

Great points ***. Yes, we will watch them more thoroughly of course and ban when necessary. But if they are ethical and abide by the TOS, then they will be fine. As long as there are no links, emails and advertisements, then they will be good on Loan Safe.

However, we may not get a lot because we are so strict. But it has proven great for me in attracting ethical professionals like ***, Andrew, CoronaSteve and Kimbly. These people know that we are on to something here that is bigger than us.

[Moe Bedard]

OK, this is a border line advertisement here James. You placed your company in your sig and we don't know who you are, what you do or if you just got off the bus from prison for fraud or forgery .

Lets do a beta test with you James, if you don't mind. What is your full name and mortgage licensing info so I can do a quick search on you and your company? Do you have a problem with that?

What is your background and what tips can you give the community right now in regards to mortgages etc???

Thanks in advance!

[Moe Bedard]

Sorry james...............

You are not even a licensed mortgage lender, and this is not the place to build your business off of...........so I am going to have to say

[COLOR="Red"][B][SIZE="5"]Bye Bye[/SIZE][/B][/COLOR]

[Kimbly]

Awww... bye bye James.

[nitag]

Kimbly, I as well work in the insurance field. Personal Lines/Commercial lines CSR for an independent agent in Nevada.. Some days I love it and some days I hate it.. I guess it depends on the clients


Moe and ***, thanks so much for protecting this community... Its wonderful to see....

Bye bye James...


nitag
[I]I fought Avelo Mortgage and won!!![/I]

[Kimbly]

Nitag - I started out on the agency side as a personal lines CSR. I much prefer the company side of things.... I like that I'm buffered from the insureds. But, I really love what I do. It's always interesting and diverse and I get to travel for business. No complaints!

[Moe Bedard]

no problemo ladies..... geez, not long after we do a small beta test to allow these guys to comment and BAM, trolling for biz....I am sure it was just a prankster messing with us all. Nothing better to do I guess.

***, I agree that the "shoe salesman" turned "loan officer" turned "loss mitigation consultant" needs to be dealt with swiftly so as not to expose the readers of this board.

There is a force presently that has that capacity. All of the mods! Remember how quickly the guillotine came down on me before Moe and I had an opportunity to talk? Shoot, I got banned twice in a month and had posts deleted!

So the system in place DOES work.

With the addition of application/approval process, Moe will have the ability to pre-screen a person before they are allowed to post. If the unscrupulous tries to slide in as a homeowner or other innocent, their posts are still easily deleted along with the aforementioned ban.

I was reading a post this morning in which there was some detailed discussion going on, but there was a very viable option that was overlooked. I know this because I have done it.

In my opinion, (and I realize that I am a new poster here,) a few select forward mortgage folks, a reverse mortgage person possibly, a debt management person, the attorney presence is here all ready would be beneficial to the readers of this forum.

I am not suggesting it be turned into a commercial marketplace for these providers.

Legit, caring, experienced people can offer a lot for free given the opportunity. Consider yourself in that category from everything I have read.

[Moe Bedard]

Good stuff Steve.

[Moe Bedard]

Steve,

Thanks for the compliment, yes I consider myself in that category......
We all know who banned you...... it wasn't me.......


It was just really funny that other than you, the first "Mortgage" person that Moe extends the offer to give advice and offer expertise to the members........posts right up front, after being asked for his license info, that he is not licensed and.........that he is just here to build his business up..........oh yeah and offer advice.....

I am sure it will get better, but I do have my reservations........and Moe, Andrew, and I will be keeping an eye out for the "shoe salesman" turned "loan officer" turned "loss mitigation consultant"

By the way.........this one was "car salesman"

[Matthew]

Hello Forum:

First time caller, long time listener! I think the Mortgage Broker Forum is a great idea. I have been an LO for 20 years. If there is any way my experience will be helpful to others, I am ready to share.

Mo, let me know what information you would like to vet me. I think you a performing a very valuable service.

Best Regards,

Matthew

[dog chapman]

Hi Moe,

I am a mortgage Broker located in Florida. I have been reading many of the posts and believe overall that the site is very informative and you interest in having mortgage professionals also join in the discussion is a good idea. I do feel that your readers and members would benefit.

I do believe that it is important to have a debate on the current crisis and have views from all sides. I also know that there were many creeps who did get into the business and really did some major damage to a lot of people.

I would be happy to answer questions and provide my perspective on the current turmoil and how the current response and proposed regulations will affect the borrowers and the overall industry. I can share what I have been seeing in my little part of the world.


I do feel that there is a lot of misinformation and some misunderstanding on how our industry operates at various levels and any help i can provide to clarify that there are in fact ethical and upfront mortgage brokers that practice everyday.

I look forward to any questions and comments.

Best Regards,

[Persistence]

Moe,

My answer is really late. I just found this Forum on my Forum list. I did not see three of these Forum offerings until tonight.

I know many mortgage brokers and realtors would cry foul at this post, but I think there are no legitimate, arms length, mortgage brokers. Why would I be so jaded? It's because realtors send buyers to the brokers they know that can get loans approved if banks say no OR if the banks don't have a product or an interest rate the buyer desires.

THEN the mortgage brokers (even on "A" paper loans) make money from the incentives that the lenders pay them for the business-PLUS a fee from the buyer. Realtors and mortgage brokers help each other make a living.

The everyday "A" paper borrower has not yet figured this out because they usually are looking for a very low interest rate and they typically have a down payment and their loan process is very standard. They have not had a reason to look for violations OR look forensically at their loan. We were a "B" borrower with cash and we got scorched, but it taught us how the process goes. Not good,not ethical, not legal.

I have learned through this bizarre situation we have found ourselves in, is that in order for a real estate purchase to truly be fair and to make sure your own interests are represented and details are explained, owners should hire an attorney to coach them through a home sale and the attorney also can deal with the banks and mortgage brokers. I will never pay a realtor or have a mortgage broker make money from me AND lie to me again.

With that said, I want to say it is a tribute to the fairness of this website that a section like this would be offered.

Mortgage brokers probably won't participate on this site because they are busy making money because they shifted from being "experts" on Hybrid Arms and are now FHA "specialists" trying to help troubled buyers that were sold Hybrid Arms with no disclosures. Irony.

[ferminet]

Persistence-
The difference between a broker and a bank is that the broker has to show you what he's making, the bank doesn't. Does that make you more comfortable dealing with the bank?Brokers generally offer lower costs and rates because they have lower overhead. If you are
uncomfortable with realtor referral you can select a broker independently.

There are many dishonest brokers (and bankers) but there are plenty of ethical ones. This site is proof. As you say, there is no business to be had here, yet many of us are on here answering questions. We don't want to see any more borrowers get screwed.

[Persistence]

Ferminet,

I appreciate what you are saying but the truth is banks are regulated and my opinion is there is not enough regulation with mortgage brokers. Banks advertise their rates and if a loan is granted by the bank to the consumer, they still have to follow the very laws we discuss on this website. There is alot of "wiggle" room for mortgage brokers as demonstrated through the last few years.

The banks are the ones getting the information from the mortgage brokers. There is no contact with the consumer and the bank. In my opinion, the banks would have easily declined many of these loans if they worked with the consumer directly. In my case, if only the lender had called me to question things-such as the appraisal-we would have cancelled our home sale. Instead the mortgage broker collaborated with the seller's agent and an appraiser with NO discussion with us and somehow dug up an appraiser that would confirm the number they wanted. This goes on all the time-it always has.

I think laws regarding mortgage brokers, ownership of the appraisal, and the communication aspects of a real estate transaction need to be written and passed. It would protect banks and consumers.

You know what really bugs me? Now many people have to go to the bank and ask for a modification because a mortgage broker wheedled a loan from the bank and from them. If many of us on this website revealed the story of our loans to you, you would understand the depth of it.

Persistence

[ferminet]

Persistence-
It is a matter of perception, not reality that banks have tougher regulation. Let me give you an example;

I have a customer that got a refinance loan from me (15 year fixed at 4.875%), and we sold servicing to a large national bank. The customer had perfect credit. About a year later
the customer came back from a one month vacation and was horrified to realize she hadn't made her payment. She was only a few weeks behind, but she called servicer and wanted to pay by phone so she wouldn't be late. Instead, they suggested that she refi and roll in her credit cards balances. If she did, they wouldn't report her late. She didn't really want to refi, but said she'd look at it. After 6 weeks, she went to a title compay and found that she had been refinanced into a 8.875% subprime loan with a prepayment penalty of 6 month interest. By this respectable national bank. If she didn't close, she was told, they would have to report her two months delinquent. She closed and came to me.

The state of Michigan prohibits refinancing where there are no net benefits to borrower. They also cap prepayment penalties at 2%. This large national bank, however, was exempt from these state rules because it is protected (I mean regulated) by the office of comptroller of the currency. So this bank does not have to follow the rules. It can also charge more than state usury laws, because it is not regulated by the state. Several state attorney generals have sued to end this practice, so far unsuccessfully.

So if you think you're better off with a bank, better look a little closer.

[mustangpg]

Sounds like you had a bad experience. Hopefully in time your opinion of mortgage brokers and real estate agents will change, because there are very ethical people out there. Just unfortunatly you ran across ones who were not. I hope your situation improves for the best!

[Persistence]

Thanks Mustang for the comments!

Persistence

[Persistence]

Ferminet,

The story you relate enforces the "good" person, "bad" person side of all of this. With that I agree very much with you. I do know there are ethical mortgage brokers and yes there are unethical banks.

But, from what I read and have studied, a large share of these loans were done through brokers. Brokers are largely unregulated, much more so than realtors. So that helps form my overall opinion. So in order to protect myself, my investment, my family, no matter what kind of borrower I may be now or in the future, I will have an attorney protect me by advising me and coaching me.

Even some "honest" brokers do not follow RESPA or TILA because they do not really know the laws. They find loans. So if a bank is bad, a mortgage broker may not know.Honestly it is written time and time again that interest of a broker is to find a loan and get it sold and they leave it up to the borrower to figure out their rights.

What I have realized is that a highly seasoned mortgage broker with 20 years or more of experience who is ALSO honest and caring might be able to be trusted. But those are few and far between, at least here in Arizona. There is a new mortgage broker office every 10 minutes, infact, some of the very companies that were shut down by the State a few months ago in Arizona are reopening with the same unethical players, just a new name and a "new" focus. I am absolutely serious in saying (my first post) from personal knowledge that a broker here who went crazy with 2/28 arms is now billing himself as an "FHA" specialist with a new company. It is so horrible I have to joke about it so I don't continue getting madder. To me this is churning and it is wrong.

I am enjoying our conversation and I really do appreciate what you are saying and believe you. Maybe we should poll folks on this website to see whether they went to the banks or through brokers? I think you'd be suprised.

And, if you are a broker, I hope you pass along something to other brokers, if the client is obviously not qualified to get a decent loan- "just say no" and explain why. That is the most honest thing you could do.Alot of people did not even know they were considered sub-prime. They did not get a choice, and they certainly did not even know their rights because some of them had never bought a home. AND, even people with 650-680 credit scores were steered to an ARM that they did not need, I know because half my friends had this happen. No disclosures, no risk disclosure, nothing.

The scam on that was telling them that they qualified for a 10% interest rate due to ticky tack stuff on their credit report and THEN when they objected, the broker would tell them about a FANTASTIC product that would give them 6.5 %-8.7% interest for two years, then they could REFINANCE. Many of them did not ask to see what the bank qoutes were or who qouted and the brokers did not offer the information. The broker was making an opinion to sell a loan that was more money for him/her. The borrowers did not know the process so the broker is able to sell this loan.

So, let's hope that everyone is wiser after all of this! I am trying to be. Thanks for great discourse and for any honest advice you contribute to people on this website.

Persistence

[Irish Gal]

Persistence:

I appreciate your posts and perspectives alot. I agree with just about everything you say! I was a 1st time buyer (2005) in so cal and got scr***ed by a "broker" and ended up in the Countrywide and HSBC never-ending hell. I have a graduate degree -unfortunately not in finance , am no dummy, BUT was terribly naive as a 1st time buyer about the market saturation of white collar criminals out there trolling around at the time seeking their next victim re mortgage loans. NO CLUE. Clueless about how the real estate/appraisal/lender/investor/broker fields were soooo corrupt. And unregulated. I know there are good folks in any field. No one is saying everyone, all the time. But what I have learned since this nightmare began about these fields is truly something else. If anyone in any of those fields is reading this, again, not everyone, all the time. If you are honest, professional, etc. that's great. But, it is UP TO YOU to change the negative perceptions of your field by CHANGING IT for the good, not the victims of your fields to change their thinking. If I ever buy again, like you Persistence, everyone will have to go through my TEAM of attorneys before I EVER sign anything, ever again! I never knew it would turn out to be the American Nightmare it has. Never in my wildest dreams. Live and learn. That's what life is aaaaalllllll about folks ... live and learn.

Thanks for the good reading Persistence.

Peace out.

Irish Gal

[Persistence]

Irish Gal,

Thanks. I feel like I sound jaded, but I think maybe if I get a borrower prospective on here, brokers might realize out of neccessity we are learning the general ins and outs of their industry.Those that are not honest will snap out of it or go away if they realize two million people know the game.

Both my husband and I have our share of education. Like you, NOT in finance or economics. We were stunned when we realized how under educated we were about some of the details of mortgage lending in the last few years. We felt very embarrassed. But, now we know and we can fix the future. Be our own advocates and share with others that might have their toes over the cliff.

We even have realized some of the things that occurred on our first house purchase 12 years ago, that we bought and sold somewhat smoothly, that should have been questioned. So the high jinks have been going on forever.

Have a good week and if you are working through loan issues right now...may it all go well!

Persistence

[tinkerbell77]

I have worked in the mortgage industry for 10 years and I would consider myself an ethical mortgage professional. Although I am not on the orgination side of the business I would be more than happy to share any information I can. Now to that point I am in the same situation as most of the posters on this board, 2/28 ARM getting ready to adjust for the first time, and I am looking for as much information as I can get to modify my loan. It just goes to show that mortgage professionals are people just like everyone else.

[Moe Bedard]

Tinkerbell,

That is really nice of you to help..............there are alot of eithical industry people in the same boat that come here to get help with their personal situations and we are happy that we can offer the help..............but on the flip side we also have problems with the unethical ones that because of the downturn in the industry are now classifying themselves as "loan mod consultants" and "loss mitigation specialists" that join here just to get and use the information for their own monetary gain...........which is unfortunate because we offer the advice and help to the distressed homeowners for free................maybe they are afraid that their clients would find us and not need to pay them.........

[HappyHome]

Irish Gal~** Once again I couldn't agree wit h you More! As a matter of fact and please correct me if I am mistaken didn't we used to Cheer up the IMAGE of a Rally of sorts started back a few months ago..((that being the RALLY on Wash., DC??)) anyway doesn't matter But it does Matter to me how interesting yr Posts are so Rock On Girlfirend and again a Wonderful thread Here adn great t o read this stuff!! TAC from Richmond,VA[QUOTE=Irish Gal;29908]Persistence:

I appreciate your posts and perspectives alot. I agree with just about everything you say! I was a 1st time buyer (2005) in so cal and got scr***ed by a "broker" and ended up in the Countrywide and HSBC never-ending hell. I have a graduate degree -unfortunately not in finance , am no dummy, BUT was terribly naive as a 1st time buyer about the market saturation of white collar criminals out there trolling around at the time seeking their next victim re mortgage loans. NO CLUE. Clueless about how the real estate/appraisal/lender/investor/broker fields were soooo corrupt. And unregulated. I know there are good folks in any field. No one is saying everyone, all the time. But what I have learned since this nightmare began about these fields is truly something else. If anyone in any of those fields is reading this, again, not everyone, all the time. If you are honest, professional, etc. that's great. But, it is UP TO YOU to change the negative perceptions of your field by CHANGING IT for the good, not the victims of your fields to change their thinking. If I ever buy again, like you Persistence, everyone will have to go through my TEAM of attorneys before I EVER sign anything, ever again! I never knew it would turn out to be the American Nightmare it has. Never in my wildest dreams. Live and learn. That's what life is aaaaalllllll about folks ... live and learn.

Thanks for the good reading Persistence.

Peace out.

Irish Gal[/QUOTE]

[Persistence]

Hi Happy Home,

I did not catch your post for some reason, missed the thread notification. Thanks for reading what we write. It seems we agree about how to handle real estate transactions form here on out.

Scary thing I am noticing. I work in an industry closely tied to the home building industry and the realty industry, the stories I am hearing on how realtors and brokers are handling buyers when they buy foreclosures (since that is a large portion of our area's inventory-Arizona) sounds like "Pete and Repeat" of what the nation has just gone through. Also, realtors really think their contracts can not be challenged. Moe, ***, or Seniors, if you read this, be advised that 2-4 years from now in Arizona, more problems will arise on loans made from this year through next. The thing is now, with the way things are at this moment, it will be the government they are trying to fool-since they back a lions share of loans currently in place.

I sure hope first time buyers and buyers without lots of cash get advice apart from their realtors and the originating brokers. When I am asked, as I often am as a "niche" provider of services, I always say, "You know, you are probably served best by having an attorney of your choice review everything, AND, you might want to have an audit service in the wings for your loan." One person that thought about it and followed through actually was able to better protect himself when the attorney advised on a couple of things. Don't know what he will do about his loan, but I was glad to hear he took the extra steps with the real estate contract.

Thanks again Happy Home
Persistence