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  1. #1
    Member gcmedica21's Avatar
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    Taylor Bean & Whitaker: Who has my mortgage?

    Hi everyone,

    Newbie here. Have to say this website is awesome and wish i would have found it sooner.

    I am one of the people that was drug into the Taylor bean and Whitaker fiasco. I refi'd 7 days before they closed using the streamline refi due to negative equity in home. they closed and i now have 2 loans for full amount on 1 house. I am still currently tied up in it. Almost 1.5 years later and i still do not know with a shadow of doubt who has my loan. When TBW was shut down i received 4 letters from 4 different companies asking for payment. I sent nothing to anyone. Been banking all of my payments in a savings account. I have called FHA, FDIC, Freddie mac, FBI (since they closed them down), DOJ, AG, elected state officials, etc. and nothing no one seems to know WTF is going on. I hired an attorney to protect me from these people since no one else is protecting us. I know that some one is going to want this money but i am having a hard time with them taking it all. I have to pay attorneys fees because of what some one else did so i can figure out where to mail a mortgage payment to. Since this all started i have been able to tract down who i think has my loan and i think it is Cenlar. They still can not show me "proof of note" though. they are asking for payments and we are almost a year behind according to them.
    I am still upside down in my house, the value has dropped even further. I want a Modification (principal reduction, or a permanent loan mod) but i do not even know where to start. I read over this website and i have to say it is very helpful. I asked for a mod with Cenlar and they said they dont do HAMP, i have to go to a "local" bank to do that. They said they will mail me something about HARP. What does a local bank have to do with this

    Ok i think i am rambling on. there is a ton more to this story but i dont want this posting to be 5 pages long. Do any of you folks have any input or ideas? Also feel free to ask any questions. Thanks again for this website!!

    James

  2. #2
    Founder Maurice Bedard's Avatar
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    Hello James,

    Welcome to the community! Thanks for sharing your story and your kind words about our website. We are all in this together brother.

    I would pursue this if I were you from a foreclosure defense position when the time comes. Meaning, a foreclosure which is filed by notice of default with your county is an offense by your lender (whoever that may be) to your late payments so they can retain possession of the home within state legal time frames. A defense by you based on what you stated above would be, OK, do you have the right to foreclose on me because I do not think you do and if so, prove it with the original mortgage note.

    It is sort of that simple. Here are some article I have written in the past on this subject that will detail more. I am no lawyer, but just well mortgage educated..

    I hope this helps and please stick around and join the many discussoins here.

    Where’s the note, who’s the holder: Enforcement of the promissory note secured by real estate | LoanWorkout.org

    A borrower goes to a mortgage lender. The lender finances the purchase of real estate. The borrower signs a note and mortgage or deed of trust. The original lender sells the note and assigns the mortgage to an entity that securitizes the note by combining the note with hundreds or thousands of similar obligation to create a package of mortgage backed securities, which are then sold to investors.
    Unfortunately, unless you represent borrowers, the vast flow of notes into the maw of the securitization industry meant that a lot of mistakes were made. When the borrower defaults, the party seeking to enforce the obligation and foreclose on the underlying collateral sometimes cannot find the note.


    A lawyer sophisticated in this area has speculated to one of the authors that perhaps a third of the notes “securitized” have been lost or destroyed. The cases we are going to look at reflect the stark fact that the unnamed source’s speculation may be well-founded.

    UCC SECTION 3-309


    If the issue were as simple as a missing note, UCC §3-309 would provide a simple solution. A person entitled to enforce an instrument which has been lost, destroyed or stolen may enforce the instrument. If the court is concerned that some third party may show up and attempt to enforce the instrument against the payee, it may order adequate protection. But, and however, a person seeking to enforce a missing instrument must be a person entitled to enforce the instrument, and that person must prove the instrument’s terms and that person’s right to enforce the instrument. §3-309 (a)(1) & (b).

    WHO’S THE HOLDER


    Enforcement of a note always requires that the person seeking to collect show that it is the holder. A holder is an entity that has acquired the note either as the original pay or or transfer by endorsement of order paper or physical possession of bearer paper. These requirements are set out in Article 3 of the Uniform Commercial Code, which has been adopted in every state, including Louisiana, and in the District of Columbia. Even in bankruptcy proceedings, State substantive law controls the rights of note and lien holders, as the Supreme Court pointed out almost forty (40) years ago in United States v. Butner, 440 U.S. 48, 54-55 (1979).


    However, as Judge Bufford has recently illustrated,20in one of the cases discussed below, in the bankruptcy and other federal courts, procedure is governed by the Federal Rules of Bankruptcy and Civil Procedure. And, procedure may just have an impact on the issue of “who,” because, if the holder is unknown, pleading and standing issues arise.

    BRIEF REVIEW OF UCC PROVISIONS


    Article 3 governs negotiable instruments – it defines what a negotiable instrument is and defines how ownership of those pieces of paper is transferred. For the precise definition, see § 3-104(a) (“an unconditional promise or order to pay a fixed amount of money, with or without interest . . . .”) The instrument may be either payable to order or bearer and payable on demand or at a definite time, with or without interest.

    Ordinary negotiable instruments include notes and drafts (a check is a draft drawn on a bank). See § 3-104(e).


    Negotiable paper is transferred from the original payor by negotiation. §3-301. “Order paper” must be endorsed; bearer paper need only be delivered. §3-305. However, in either case, for the note to be enforced, the person who asserts the status of the holder must be in possession of the instrument. See UCC § 1-201 (20) and comments.


    The original and subsequent transferees are referred to as holders. Holders who take with no notice of defect or default are called “holders in due course,” and take free of many defenses. See §§ 3-305(b).


    The UCC says that a payment to a party “entitled to enforce the instrument” is sufficient to extinguish the obligation of the person obligated on the instrument. Clearly, then, only a holder – a person in possession of a note endorsed to it or a holder of bearer paper – may seek satisfaction or enforce rights in collateral such as real estate.

    NOTE: Those of us who went through the bank and savings and loan collapse of the 1980’s are familiar with these problems. The FDIC/FSLIC/RTC sold millions of notes secured and unsecured, in bulk transactions. Some notes could not be found and enforcement sometimes became a problem. Of course, sometimes we are forced to repeat history. For a recent FDIC case, see Liberty Savings Bank v. Redus, 2009 WL 41857 (Ohio App. 8 Dist.), January 8, 2009.

    THE RULES


    Judge Bufford addressed the rules issue this past year. See In re Hwang, 396 B.R. 757 (Bankr. C. D. Cal. 2008). First, there are the pleading problems that arise when the holder of the note is unknown. Typically, the issue will arise in a motion for relief from stay in a bankruptcy proceeding.


    According F.R.Civ. Pro. 17, “[a]n action must be prosecuted in the name of the real party in interest.” This rule is incorporated into the rules governing bankruptcy procedure in several ways. As Judge Bufford has pointed out, for example, in a motion for relief from stay, filed under F.R.Bankr.Pro. 4001 is a contested matter, governed by F. R. Bankr. P. 9014, which makes F.R. Bankr. Pro. 7017 applicable to such motions. F.R. Bankr. P. 7017 is, of course, a restatement of F. R. Civ. P. 17. In re Hwang, 396 B.R. at 766. The real party in interest in a federal action to enforce a note, whether in bankruptcy court or federal district court, is the owner of a note. (In securitization transactions, this would be the trustee for the “certificate holders.”) When the actual holder of the note is unknown, it is impossible – not difficult but impossible – to plead a cause of action in a federal court (unless the movant simply lies about the ownership of the note). Unless the name of the actual note holder can be stated, the very pleadings are defective.

    STANDING


    Often, the servicing agent for the loan will appear to enforce the note. Assume that the servicing agent states that it is the authorized agent of the note holder, which is “Trust Number 99.” The servicing agent is certainly a party in interest, since a party in interest in a bankruptcy court is a very broad term or concept. See, e.g., Greer v. O’Dell, 305 F.3d 1297, 1302-03 (11th Cir. 2002). However, the servicing agent may not have standing: “Federal Courts have only the power authorized by Article III of the Constitutions and the statutes enacted by Congress pursuant thereto. … [A] plaintiff must have Constitutional standing in order for a federal court to have jurisdiction.” In re Foreclosure Cases, 521 F.Supp. 3d 650, 653 (S.D. Ohio, 2007) (citations omitted).


    But, the servicing agent does not have standing, for only a person who is the holder of the note has standing to enforce the note. See, e.g., In re Hwang, 2008 WL 4899273 at 8.


    The servicing agent may have standing if acting as an agent for the holder, assuming that the agent can both show agency status and that the principle is the holder. See, e.g., In re Vargas, 396 B.R. 511 (Bankr. C.D. Cal. 2008) at 520.
    Read Moe’s past blog posts on the missing note theory from 2007-present:

    Deutsche Bank Foreclosures Tossed Out of Ohio Federal Court – “They Own Nothing!” - November 13, 2007


    Thus, the Judge ruled that in every instance, these submissions create a “conflict” and they “do not satisfy” the burden of demonstrating at the time of filing the complaint that Deutsche Bank was in fact the “legal” note holder.


    While the decision is great for homeowners in distress (due to providing a new escape hatch out of foreclosure), it also represents a serious roadblock. If the toxic mortgage fiasco is to be cleaned up, there must be a simple means of identifying what banks own and what they do not own. This judgment is an example of the enormous task ahead in sorting out the mortgage mess.


    32 More Foreclosures Dismissed for Lack of “Documentation”- November 19, 2007


    In another Ohio ruling on November 14th, State District Judge Kathleen Mc Donald O’Malley dismissed 32 more foreclosures for lack of “documentation”. Read the ruling /files/89778-78388
    /Deutsche_Bank_Foreclosure_Ruling.pdf”>Deutsche Ruling, we reported on the Judge Boyko decision in which he dismissed 14 Deutsche Bank foreclosures and then was followed up by Judge Rose throwing out another 27 foreclosures the following day for lack of documentation.


    This will continue to prove to be a huge issue for securitized trusts to properly prove ownership with the legal documentation of these loans. Now, it appears that some homeowners (and judges) have caught on and it is expected that many more of these cases will be thrown out of courts across America.


    Foreclosure Warfare – “It is troubling that the plaintiff has filed this case before it had any interest in it” – December 13, 2007


    “It is troubling that the plaintiff has filed this case before it had any interest in it,” Hamilton County Common Pleas Judge Steven E. Martin said in a letter to Wells Fargo’s lawyer.The judge said the foreclosure lawsuit was filed before Wells Fargo owned the mortgage – thus, the suit was premature.


    Ohio Homeowner Fights Foreclosure and Lives Payment Free for 11 Years – December 28, 2007


    Let the truth be known. Most homeowners do not respond or fight back when they are facing foreclosure. The lender files the notice of default and the court hearing comes and goes without an appearance from the defendant (homeowner). Four to six months later, the trustee’s sale happens on the court steps and the home owner becomes another foreclosure statistic.


    However, there are unique cases of people that just won’t lie down and take it. They fight back to protect their property rights and against injustice.


    Bring Down the Banks with these Foreclosure Defense Tactics - July 7. 2008


    Like any fight , you must first look at your opponents weaknesses in order to exploit them and utilize these loop holes to your advantage. Over the years lenders and banks got fat and a little lazy in their training habits and fighting tactics. I guess they assumed that they would always rule the land from their hill top estates and glass houses.


    Missing Mortgage Notes and Deceptive Mortgage Servicing: Wall Street Shell Game 101 -


    What if you didn’t have to leave and all you had to do was “defend” your property rights by asking a simple question to who you may “think” is your lender. The question, “Mr. Lender, would you be so kind to produce the mortgage note that I signed when I bought the home with my original signature?” Think of it like when you buy and sell a vehicle.


    Does Your Lender Have the Right to Foreclose on You? October 15, 2008


    In federal court, written proof of who holds the mortgage must be presented at the time the foreclosure is filed. In county common pleas courts, proof must be presented before a judgment is issued. Our past “missing note” and “illegal foreclosure proceedings” blog posts focused in the great State of Ohio and the honorable Federal Court Judges, Boyko, Rose and O’Malley decisions that sent shock waves throughout online legal communities everywhere.
    Best Regards,

    Maurice Bedard
    Founder of LoanSafe.org

    DISCLAIMER: The comments by me and the materials available at this web site are for informational purposes only and not for the purpose of providing legal advice. Most of the information you find here is easily available on the internet. You should contact your attorney to obtain advice with respect to any particular issue or problem. The opinions expressed at or through this site are the opinions of the individual author and may not reflect the opinions of the firm or any individual attorney. Please Read our Privacy Policy and Legal Disclaimer Here.

  3. #3
    Member gcmedica21's Avatar
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    Moe ,

    Thanks a lot for your input.
    On a odd note, shortly after posting, today i received a phone call from the FDIC attorney who is representing the U.S. against TBW. They told me that indeed, Cenlar has my note and that they will provide me with a copy of this note next week. I asked about getting a Mod and who is going to pay my attorney fees and all she could tell me was that i need to deal with cenlar. So i called cenlar and asked them to provide me with a mod packet and, how do i go about getting my attorney fees and she said for me to fax in a written request to have those paid. Wonder what the likelihood of having them do that is? She told me that TBW is protected and i more than likely will never see that money. Who is protecting me? doesn't the FDIC work for me as a tax payer? (just a thought).
    So after i get the mod packet in the mail i will start to work on that and i will probably have a ton of questions about that to get the biggest chance of success. So i guess i sit back and wait for some paperwork. Thanks again and i will be hanging around and partaking in some discussions. I have learned a tremendous amount from this ordeal, and still learning so hopefully i can help and be helped at the same time.

    James

  4. #4
    Member gcmedica21's Avatar
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    Hi guys,

    Just a update. (started school back so been a while since post)
    I recieved my Mod packet at end of year. Filled out had to be back by 1/9. Waiting response i recieved a notification(from usps)that it was delievered on 7th. Still no coupon book or anything in mail ref to making a monthly payment other than the one i recieved several months ago for a payment back in Feb, 10....
    (in ref to last post) I asked FDIC for proof of my loan with Cenlar and i still havent recieved a thing from Cenlar or FDIC about who "has" my loan. They all keep telling me that Cenlar has it but they can NOT prove it.
    Again, thanks for this forum!! Because of all the posts on here i was able to fill the Mod packet much easier.

  5. #5
    Junior Member KRStas's Avatar
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    James- I am in the same boat- I have been aprroved for the modification with Cenlar though Bayview, am on my 2nd trial period payment- am told it will be permanent after 3rd payment, at that point there will be new paperwork to sign. They didnt add time to my mortgage so I am hopeful. Its all very bizzare though, Cenlar has never recorded a tranfer from Taylor Bean, but from what I am seeing that doesnt seem to matter- should, but doesnt - good luck, Bayview is fairly quick with their response once they do their verifications! Hope this helps

  6. #6
    Member gcmedica21's Avatar
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    Congrats on your Mod!! Hope it all works out for you.

    So did you have a TBW loan to begin with?
    Are you still with cenlar or bayview now?
    How long did Bayview take?
    How is bayview?


    Thanks again i am still waiting to hear my answer on HAMP mod from Bayview.

    James

  7. #7
    Junior Member KRStas's Avatar
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    Yes, I was originaly with Taylor Bean, then Cenlar took over my loan and Bayview is handling the processing of the loan mod. An interesting fact however, Cenlar has never recorded a tranfer, but since my loan was Freddie Mac, I seriuosly doubt it is "lost". As far as Bayview, the woman I delt with was fairly helpful, payments only went down 300, but that is better than a poke in the eye I suppose! Good Luck- and be confident, they dont play the games BofA does.

  8. #8
    Member gcmedica21's Avatar
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    Hi Everyone,
    wanted to post an update about my situation. It has been a long road and still not over with.
    Gosh where do i start......ok so the HAMP/Refi thing didnt work out. Bayview only wanted more paperwork and more paperwork. Never would give us a answer. After looking into it i knew we would not qualify because of the date of 7/09 of original note. Anyway, No go with Bayview.
    So Cenlar decided to file foreclosure paper work around 4/11. My original attorney who mainly does closing and etc, said we need help.......so we began calling other attorneys to find help. We found a great bulldog of a attorney too!!!!
    Cenlar filed foreclosure paperwork, we argued it and WON, judge ruled (1/12)in our favor!!!! (not over yet)
    Cenlar appealed his decision, and won(5/12)
    We just filed our affidavit, to get my side finally heard in court. Thats the part that fascinates me........after all of this i am just now being heard in court. This has been going on since 8/09 and just now!!!!!!
    Again thank you for the help this forum has brought me!!!! I am still fighting to find out who has my note. I am sure it is sitting somewhere in Florida as evidence in a bankruptcy case for Taylor Bean and Whitaker.

    James

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