Late as of today - Phone calls have started

[AZChick]

There is phone call harrassement but there also is mail harrassement. How many letters are needed to tell you that your home is going to be sold.....I'm at 20 letters now within 3 days...my mail box is clogged full. Plus I have more certified letters waiting for me at the post office....The post man doesn't know what to say.....that's my vent....seems like settling a 2nd is no longer very unsettling....very good advice, I have a friend dealing with this.....I'll let them know what I've learned on this thread....

[snapple candy]

AZ,
this is unbelievable. So extreme, I dont know what to say.

[fallacy]

dogatemy,

Thank you for sharing your story. My plan is to notify them of my situation (about to lose my job, exhausted all of my savings and retirement, and maxed out credit cards) and I do not know when I will be able to make my next payment on either mortgage (don't plan on making it again). I will also notify them that I have retained an attorney. If they continue to call me, I will fax and send out via certified mail my cease and desist letter.

If they offer me a settlement, I hope it will be after the foreclosure. My timeline guesstimate is 6 months of no payments before they file the NOD, and then 90 days from there puts me into 2010. If that is the case, I would have one year to save up before filing my 2010 taxes and possibly taking the hit depending on if I am insolvent.

Fortunately for me, I have a relative that is going to buy a house in his name, let me rent for a couple years, and then sell it back to me for the same price he is buying it for. I will end up saving more than $1000 a month. I know there are many out there that do not have this option, and my heart goes out to them.

[AZChick]

They screwed up and recorded the NOT in the wrong county, therefore, I will most likely recieve 30+ more letters that are exactly the same just different county info. What is the point in this? I'm sure it's harrassement to try to make me so sick of it I'll pay something....not gonna happen. I called the lawyers office and they said there is nothing they can do, all the letters have to go out to make sure I get the NOT... BS...it's becoming an embarrassement, the post man must think I'm being sued by about 10 people.

On a different topic: I think many people have gotten hip to the game and are bailing themselves out by simply buying another house or allowing a family member to purchase a house in their name. Sounds good to me, when you can buy a home for 80K 90K and have maybe a $550 a month payment, why not....

[dogatemy]

Originally Posted by AZChick

it's becoming an embarrassement, the post man must think I'm being sued by about 10 people.

I was going to joke with you about the mail-spam but you seem a bit angry about it. I'm sorry.

Just remember that EVERY DIME your lender spends on junk mail is helping put someone's kids through college and helping someone else make it through another day. Just tell the post office guy that you are working hard to keep him employed in these tough economic times. :-) Don't forget to recycle the paper!

I decided to get a large post office box and have all my mail forwarded there for the next year. My box cost $50/year and I filled out a temporary mail forwarding order. I only check it once every few days which is sufficient.

[AZChick]

Thanks for the comic relief dogatemy, it's so needed these days. I just need to focus on the goal ahead....in a few months I'll be completely out of debt once and for all. This whole thing has been very enlightening.....the bank hasn't really wanted to work with me, the loss mitigation department is obviously full of $9 an hour employees who could care less, and the lawyers office is foreclosing on homes by the dozen. I don't think we were supposed to get out of this mess, we were just supposed to be robots and keep paying for a depreciating asset. I really worry about the future of this country, how many of us are just a hair from disaster? I do know the soccer moms in line with me to drop our kids off in the morning who are driving new Armada's, Escaldes, and Yukons are probably broke..... The American dream just doesn't work that way anymore....

[fallacy]

Here's an update on my situation. I still have not received any phone calls from GMAC since April 16. I did receive a letter from them on April 24 stating they received a request from me in March requesting a loan mod, and if I was still interested to contact them IMMEDIATELY

[fallacy]

I should also mention that in addition to everything going on with my house, I found out someone stole my identity and opened up two cell phone accouts in the Washington DC. I received two calls from different collection agencies saying I was past due on these accounts.

I finally got through to the carriers' fraud department, and they are investigating. One of the carriers (starts with an A, ends with a T) said they would get back to me by end of day with an update. That was last Wednesday. I called this morning for my update, and I was told that when the fraudulent account was set up, the thief supplied a password on the account. Since I do not know the password, they will not provide me with an update If I want an update on my own ID theft case, I would need to know the password the thief set up.

WOW.

[dogatemy]

Originally Posted by fallacy

If I want an update on my own ID theft case, I would need to know the password the thief set up. WOW.

Just tell them you are with the Bush Administration and you need all information related to all accounts in the DC area. This should bypass the need for any passwords..

[fallacy]

I received a letter in the mail yesterday saying my 2nd is late, and I must pay now to avoid collections or even a lawsuit I have $330k in debt including my mortgages with no savings and no 401K. Lawsuit, huh?

[fallacy]

UPDATE: I received a friendly letter on Saturday reminding me that I have not paid in two months, and I am in default If I want to avoid foreclosure, I need to make a $4,000 payment now.

Also, I received a notice from one of my CC companies saying that since I have a report of a collection agency on my credit report (fraud case involving my identity being stolen) they are reducing my credit limit. However, they do go on to say they value my business. Awww...makes you feel all warm and fuzzy.

[fallacy]

UPDATE: As gravymark stated with GMAC, I have started receiving calls with attempts at loan modification at my 90 day mark.

Big shift in their "tone"

[dogatemy]

Originally Posted by fallacy

Also, I received a notice from one of my CC companies saying that since I have a report of a collection agency on my credit report (fraud case involving my identity being stolen) they are reducing my credit limit. However, they do go on to say they value my business. Awww...makes you feel all warm and fuzzy.

I use credit cards to fund my business. My first late payment was back on 4/1. I assume this means I should expect a reduction in available credit sometime in the third month?

[fallacy]

Originally Posted by dogatemy

I use credit cards to fund my business. My first late payment was back on 4/1. I assume this means I should expect a reduction in available credit sometime in the third month?

Even before I missed my first payment, some of my CC companies began reducing my credit limit even with a FICO in the 700 range. It is pretty common with the screws being tightened on CC companies.

It's not to say all of them are doing it. I have Citi and Bank of America that reduced mine...two of the banks that are/were struggling.

[dogatemy]

Originally Posted by fallacy

It's not to say all of them are doing it. I have Citi and Bank of America that reduced mine...two of the banks that are/were struggling.

I have a $2500 card with Bank of America which has been untouched. I stopped paying my HELOC with Chase back in April but my $10,000 in credit cards with Chase have been untouched. No credit limit reductions, rate increases or additional fees so far. That's why I asked about your situation. I keep expecting to login to my accounts and find all my cards are no longer valid.

[fallacy]

Originally Posted by dogatemy

I have a $2500 card with Bank of America which has been untouched. I stopped paying my HELOC with Chase back in April but my $10,000 in credit cards with Chase have been untouched. No credit limit reductions, rate increases or additional fees so far. That's why I asked about your situation. I keep expecting to login to my accounts and find all my cards are no longer valid.

We applied for and had in reserve a $25k LOC set aside to cover adoption expenses should they occur. Without any notice, B of A closed the LOC just as we were in the process of finalizing an adoption. Fortunately for us (for lack of a better phrase), the adoption fell through, and we did not need the LOC.

[dogatemy]

Originally Posted by fallacy

We applied for and had in reserve a $25k LOC set aside to cover adoption expenses should they occur. Without any notice, B of A closed the LOC

I have a couple of courtesy checks from BOA. I am seriously considering cashing a $2400 check and putting that in savings. I can also buy a few $1500 gift cards too. If they cancel the accounts for no reason then I will simply stop making the payments and they can eat the losses.

We'll see.. I haven't decided but I also know I am running out of time.

[fallacy]

dogatemy - Have you had any run-ins with your CC companies?

I received two letters from GMAC. One dated June 1 and the other June 2. Both letters are identical (this is where the spam mail starts?). The letter outlines that I am in default on both of my mortgages, and if I do not pay $5,500 with a secure form of payment within 30 days they will accelerate the foreclosure process. One can only hope, right? They also stated that they will be sending someone by periodically at my own expense to verify we still occupy the home Hope they don't try anything funny with the door locks. My wifey is trained to hit a center of mass with all 14 rounds from a Glock 23.

Good news is that we will be fully moved out by Friday. Only wish I could remove the $7,500 Trane unit I paid for back in 2006

[dogatemy]

Originally Posted by fallacy

Good news is that we will be fully moved out by Friday. Only wish I could remove the $7,500 Trane unit I paid for back in 2006

I bought my house in late 2005 and also bought a new Trane unit back in 2006. Since I have the original Home Inspection Report stating the former unit was in poor condition; I plan to replace the current unit with a cheap one from Craigslist and take the one I paid for with me to the investment property. As long as you restore the house to its original condition then there is little they can do.

[auroraproblem]

Originally Posted by dogatemy

I live over near 19th Ave and Bethany Home. My first is $130k and my second is with Chase for $35k. I also own an investment property in the same area that I recently purchased for $80k. I don't have more than a few hundred in my checking account but I do have a significant 401k and IRA balances. (I love to gamble :-) ) I'm not a hardship but I have taken a $20k paycut in the past 1.5 years. My management kept telling us everything was fine but on 4/1 my boss announced another $8k/year reduction that I was not expecting. These payments used to be easy but I recently had to decide between medical care for my *** and making a mortgage payment. My cats come first.

I did write a check to an attorney for a couple of hours of his time. He looked over the paperwork for both loans on my primary residence and the loan on my investment property.
Basically he said the bank could not touch my IRA or 401k. Since there is little left in my checking account; it would cost more to garnish my bank account than what I had in there.

The attorney said..

• I should refuse to make any payments on my second
• I should tell them I am loosing my job (even if i'm not)
• I should explain that I have about 10% of the loan in my IRA and I could liquidate that (at a loss) to settle the loan
• they may try to negotiate the amount
• don't ever pay more than 15% of the loan balance
• some of his clients have settled their recourse loans for as little as 6% of the balance
• make sure they know you have an attorney
• get it in writing before sending them a check
• have an attorney review the settlement offer
• be prepared for the tax implications of a 1099 for the forgiven amount

Chase called tonight. The guy was really nice. He said I should fax over a letter barring them from contacting me via phone so the calls will stop. He said Chase would not make any effort to settle until after the foreclosure is complete. Once the foreclosure process is over they will offer to settle.

If you have any questions then feel free to post

Seems very unwise of Chase. Frankly, if WF puts me in that situation it is simply discharge time. After running up all my credit cards to try and keep the house, there is no way I am going to discuss settlement with them after the foreclosure. Seems like a rather dumb position on the part of Chase, I can't imagine they get much of anything against the loans since the borrower has lost the incentive to try and settle the debt.

[fallacy]

Originally Posted by dogatemy

I bought my house in late 2005 and also bought a new Trane unit back in 2006. Since I have the original Home Inspection Report stating the former unit was in poor condition; I plan to replace the current unit with a cheap one from Craigslist and take the one I paid for with me to the investment property. As long as you restore the house to its original condition then there is little they can do.

Unfortunately for me, my Trane unit is on the roof so I would need a crane. Plus I had it installed to replace two swamp coolers. Oh well, I ended up taking all of my upgraded fixtures and put the cheap original ones back up.

UPDATE: I received an overnight package from GMAC saying I was approved for a loan mod on my 2nd...even though I didn't request one. Both of my loans are non-course anyway, so they are just wasting their time.

[dogatemy]

Originally Posted by fallacy

Unfortunately for me, my Trane unit is on the roof so I would need a crane. Plus I had it installed to replace two swamp coolers. Oh well, I ended up taking all of my upgraded fixtures and put the cheap original ones back up.

UPDATE: I received an overnight package from GMAC saying I was approved for a loan mod on my 2nd...even though I didn't request one. Both of my loans are non-course anyway, so they are just wasting their time.

My A/C guy said he can get a crane for $75 and the cost of moving my Crane AC unit is about $500 including crane and labor charges. Have you checked Craigslist to see what AC units in your area are going for and what Evap Coolers are going for? My AC guy said he'll find me an old one to put back so I don't have to deal with it and the labor charges are minimal if I give him enough time to do it.

I love how the banks are grasping for straws. They have screwed and threatened the american public for so long they don't know how to react when they are left holding the bag. It still amazes me that GMAC wrote me a mortgage for one house while another was upside down by $100k. Do banks really believe the average american making $50k/year can afford to spend $2200/month on mortgage payments?? If I owned GMAC stock then I would have sold it because I don't believe 60% leverage is an acceptable risk for any public OR private enterprise.

[fallacy]

At the advice of my real estate agent, I am going to list my house as a short sale. Really sad that we are not expecting more than $50,000 for it when we paid $175,000 for it just three years ago with close to $25,000 in upgrades we made.

I figured listing it would not hurt. Both of my mortgages are non-recourse so I am not worried about lawsuits or even tax implications. Whatever to save the almighty FICO, right?

[DrowningInSanDiego]

Quick question, since I thought I understood recourse v. non-recourse. You mentioned a couple times that both loans are non-recourse, but in your original post, you mentioned for the 2nd, you refinanced, and took extra out for home improvements and to pay off stuff? By refinancing, wouldn't that make your 2nd recourse and technically, there could be a deficiency judgment?

[fallacy]

My initial thought was my 2nd loan would have become recourse, opening me up to a possible deficiency judgment, something that I was preparing myself for when I walked. However, the professor, a law firm in Tucson, and my real estate agent each cited sources where courts in Arizona have ruled that purchase money loans whether refinanced or extended retain their non-recourse status.

When my original purchase money loan ($175K) was refinanced, GMAC only covered $170K. They required me to take out a 2nd to cover the balance of the original purchase money loan ($5K) and all closing costs ($5K). Had I taken a HELOC outright, then that would have been recourse.

GMAC realizes this, and they are trying to get me to sign modification papers without me even applying for one. I get calls from their loan modification department almost daily.