Is Cheerleading Appropriate

[franklinhelp]

I just signed off today on a modification where the reduced my principle in 1/2 and set aside 38% of my principle balance as a non-interest bearing postponement

Sorry thats a reduction of interest by about half (4 points) for 3 years and set aside 38%.......as a non-interest bearing deferment

[ProfessorShays]

Let me perhaps cast it in a different light from a lender's perspective. If, as I suspect, the current value of the property is $375K, then in essence what they have done is provided you with 100% financing for the property value. In addition to that, what they have done is entered into an equity participation agreement with you, where at the time of sale their $375K loan gets paid off and they get the first $220K in equity.

I would suggest that given the home is in Florida, and unlike California and other neighboring states where anti-deficiency legislation is in place, you could be facing a pretty hefty post foreclosure deficiency judgment, so this deal makes sense I suspect given your circumstances.

But with non-recourse protection in place (or if I was judgment proof or able to discharge the debt through bankruptcy), this might not fit the definition of being a good deal.

Daniel

[cactus77727]

First Moe, of the posts I've read, I don't recall reading any that suggested people make a decision without careful discernment and further guidance from paid professional consultation. In fact, quite the opposite. I myself picked up on this when I was a newbie, and try to remember to add the "seek professional advice from an attorney etc" disclaimer when needed. I have seen many other users do the same. Professor Shays drives it home, over, and over, and over again. Also, I think there is something in the Loansafe registration or terms of service about it too, isn't there? If not, I would suggest seeking professional advice from an attorney skilled in internet law...

Next, I've never seen an online forum that has more courtesy and respect among its users. I haven't read the entire forum, but I've not seen much in the way of personal attacks among users. 'Spirited' debate, on opinion, policies, banks, politicians, and servicing companies, yes! (but isn't that the idea?)Compared to other internet forums, I'd give Loansafe an A+ in this area.

As for Cat and Professor, everyone knows Loansafe is better for having both of them. It wouldn't be the same without either of them. Many have said it, they are both greatly appreciated, and they both know it.

Moe, the Loansafe About Us page defines the sites main purpose as being about saving peoples homes. However, it is obvious another purpose has evolved out from the Loansafe users. That second pupose serves as a vital support network for people who will lose their homes. After I was up to speed on the reality of my situation, Loansafe bacame that support network for me. The benefit I have received from the forum in this respect is immeasurable. I would ask for you to continue to allow people to let it all hang out, tell it like it is, and not be afraid to post their story and opinions, in all its ugly truth. At least in the Walk Away forum, and the Anything Goes forum. (and all within the rules of acceptable behavior of course) I think that is what makes Loansafe so great.

As for a new area named "Success for Walkers" or whatever. I don't know folks. If I'm honest with myself, this whole experience is all about failure. For me, that's how it should be described and logged in the history books. You learn a heck of a lot from failure. Success is easy to live through, and you really don't learn much from it. I want to remember this whole nasty experience as one of my lifes greatest failures. And I never want to do it again.

That does NOT mean I'm a failure personally, or that your forum is a failure Moe. My life is certainly better for it, I am more knowledgeable, and I have been empowered because of Loansafe. By any measure, Loansafe is a smashing success. Thank you Moe for it.

[baileys dad]

"If you can meet Disaster and Truimph/ and treat those two imposters the same"
Rudyard Kipling

[nana8]

Cactus-
I'm with you! If I hadn't found this forum, been able to get answers to or advice about the hard questions that I was unable to get anywhere else, this whole situation would have been much more unbarable for me. Thank you to EVERYONE who takes the time to throw in thier .02 cents. I espically want to thank The Prof for giving us all the answers we NEED to hear instead of the answers we WANT to hear. I got enough of that BS when dealing with the lenders, lawyers, customer srvice people, and the like.
I too consider this to be a failure. I never thought I would be in a position where walking away was ultimetly my only option. But, on the other hand, since reality has slapped me in the face and I am dealing with it, I guess I can say that I will make it through this, learn from the mistakes, NEVER make them again....and consider that as a sucess
Keep up the invaluable work you are all doing here....there are countless others out there just like us, that hopefully can find thier way to this forum, that will need the support and answers that they can find here.

[KT in CA]

Here here Cactus.

[Boneman]

May God bless you all! I'm so thankful for this forum already and all the wonderful folks willing to share their experiences so that others might benefit from them--- good, bad and ugly.

We all learn as we go and you can learn as much (or more) from a bad experience compared to a good one.

I love that old story of the young feller speaking to the wise sage...

"Sir- I think I've made a terrible mistake."

"Good!" -says the sage. "You must learn not to repeat it."

"How did you become so wise, Sir?" -asks the young one.

"Good judgment comes from a life of experience." -he says... "Experience comes from a life of mistakes. Wisdom comes from learning not to make the same ones twice."

>>>> Terrible mistakes are wonderful opportunities to gain wisdom<<<<

[Maurice Bedard]

Thanks cactus77727 and everyone else for continuing the discussion.

First Moe, of the posts I've read, I don't recall reading any that suggested people make a decision without careful discernment and further guidance from paid professional consultation. In fact, quite the opposite. I myself picked up on this when I was a newbie, and try to remember to add the "seek professional advice from an attorney etc" disclaimer when needed. I have seen many other users do the same. Professor Shays drives it home, over, and over, and over again.

You know what, you are 100% right here and I agree. I just have been through a rough year here in the back ground of LoanSafe. Yes, I have been sent many letter from big corporate attorneys and the last one may actually shut this website down. More on that later in another thread.

Also, I think there is something in the Loansafe registration or terms of service about it too, isn't there? If not, I would suggest seeking professional advice from an attorney skilled in internet law...

Funny you say that. I am doing that right now!

As for Cat and Professor, everyone knows Loansafe is better for having both of them. It wouldn't be the same without either of them. Many have said it, they are both greatly appreciated, and they both know it.

I agree 110%. We are all blessed to have them around!

As for a new area named "Success for Walkers" or whatever. I don't know folks. If I'm honest with myself, this whole experience is all about failure. For me, that's how it should be described and logged in the history books. You learn a heck of a lot from failure. Success is easy to live through, and you really don't learn much from it. I want to remember this whole nasty experience as one of my lifes greatest failures. And I never want to do it again.

No pain, no gain! What doesn't kill us, makes us stronger.

That does NOT mean I'm a failure personally, or that your forum is a failure Moe.

Far from it! I am a man who believes like you and we must go through these life changing and painful events to grow and become better people.

Thanks so much! This forum has done for me more than you all can imagine and I appreciate you ALL for that!!!

[Maurice Bedard]

FYI - I will be adding a walk away from your ball and chain (or something like that?) forum soon!!

Any clever names or ideas that may get more people to lighten up, post their walk away stories. I think some homeowners may be afraid to post that they are walking away because we have been such huge advocates of modifications.

I want to change that. We have always advocated for what the homeowner wants and now, we will offer alternative advice that they may not like, but badly need.

[Enough Already]

...
Moe said:
You know what, you are 100% right here and I agree. I just have been through a rough year here in the back ground of LoanSafe. Yes, I have been sent many letter from big corporate attorneys and the last one may actually shut this website down. More on that later in another thread.
----------------------------------------------

I'm sorry to hear you've come under fire for this site. Sadly, though it's no suprise. The big banks DO NOT want the people coming together, sharing info and working together. If loan mods, walking away, and short sales become socially acceptable it will really cramp their style. This type of forum is their worst nightmare - it's bad for business.

If there's anything we forum dwellers can do to help, please let us know!

[Maurice Bedard]

Thanks for your concern.

Apparently Fits American Title has some software named Loan Safe. They are claiming we are infringing on their trademark with this website and it is bad for their business. I guess they have had clients complain about the content we provide. Which happens to be, LENDERS & BANKS!!

They want me to change the name of the site or not offer any kind of help or commerce to people.

[dogatemy]

I vote for LoanFail.org. :-)

[baileys dad]

How about Un-Safe Loans??

[Maurice Bedard]

I like those A LOT!! LoanFail.org and UnSafeLoans.org, great...

But I was thinking something that may take us to the next level. It seems like this is more than just about making loans safe and saving homes. It's now about walking away with your head up. It's about a community of people that are trying to not lose their dreams just because they may lose what was 'sold" to them as the American Dream.

It's a community of support and people who realize what is important to them....

What if we had a next to the walk away success forum a rent section with a rental search portal for free and a free job section? It seems like many people who come here may need help with one or the other. At the very least, they could research possibilites and exchange ideas.

I have a domain a registered a while back and I was thinking on using it.

How is SavingtheDream.org?

Keep in mind that it will not just be about saving homes, but saving our dreams and creating new ones.

[HopingtoFind]

"What if we had a next to the walk away success forum a rent section with a rental search portal for free and a free job section? It seems like many people who come here may need help with one or the other. At the very least, they could research possibilites and exchange ideas."

I really like that idea, having several rental properties myself that I have recently modified, I have often thought about possibly offering one of my available units to a person or family that just walked away, especially getting to know them through this process...

[Maurice Bedard]

Awesome. Thanks so much for the feedback!

[RimToRimHiker]

As many have already posted, this website has been such a help. The feedback is incredible. Thanks to posts I read early on by Professor Shays and Cactus and several others, I sought out legal advise and began to look at the whole picture from a "what is best for our financial future" viewpoint. When I first found this website, I was in such a dark place. I didn't know which way to turn. I was so torn between doing the "right thing" and doing what really needed to be done. My husband could see it was a sinking ship and rapidly taking on more water with every payment we made. I couldn't see that 4 months ago. I was too emotionally caught up in this being our home, preserving my precious FICO score and so on. This website planted all the seeds I needed to start looking at our situation in a different light. And the lawyer I spoke to provided the water. He encouraged us to put it all down on paper and to come to a conclusion based on the the numbers. We did not make the decision to walk away just willy nilly. We did what Prof Shays, our lawyer and so many of you encouraged us to do. We carefully analyzed where we were when we bought the house, where we are today, where we will be if we stay and continue to pour money into this asset that declines in value almost weekly and where we will be if we cut our loses, walkaway and start rebuilding our financial picture.

All the financial input has been great but what has been even better is being able to come to a place where people understand the tremendous emotional roller coaster ride this whole scenario is. One day it's fine. I'm happy. We've made the decision. It's the best decision for our financial future and I'm fine with. The next day I will start to think about a project I would like to do such as a try a new paint technique I saw on HGTV and get bummed cause I know that would be a waste of time and money because we'll be moving within a few months. Coming here has helped me let the emotions out. You get the picture.

And the humor. I've laughed until I've almost cried at many of the posts. It's so true, that laughter can be the best medicine.

Moe, many thanks for creating this website. All of us who have been caught up in this dismal real estate debacle needed a place to gather to share our thoughts, our ups and downs, vital information and we found it right here.

How about EmptySafe.org? After taking out the loans so many of us did because we listened to a bunch of real estate and mortgage "experts" we now have a empty safes.

[Maurice Bedard]

Wow, the comments, ideas and thanks are what always make this place great. I am so glad that you have been able to process your thoughts with the education you have found here. You then made the best decsion for "you and your family" not the bank or your FICO! That is the best thing you could have ever done.

EmptySafe.org, ANOTHER great one!

[baileys dad]

Moe wrote:

What if we had a next to the walk away success forum a rent section with a rental search portal for free and a free job section? It seems like many people who come here may need help with one or the other. At the very least, they could research possibilites and exchange ideas.

I have a domain a registered a while back and I was thinking on using it.

How is SavingtheDream.org?

Keep in mind that it will not just be about saving homes, but saving our dreams and creating new ones.

I, for one, think that this is a good idea. Whatever route a member here ultimately takes (mod, walk away, short sale etc), there will still be challenges afterward given the state of the economy. As such, any and all help would be welcome.
Another sub-forum might be how to stretch your dollar...ways that people have found to economize....
My only regret thus far is that I didn't find this place earlier in my struggles...

[nana8]

Moe-
I think SavingtheDream.org is an outstanding name. It pretty much says it all, wether your dream is to save your house through mod or refi, or to walk away through short-sale, deed in lieu, or or whatever, we will all live through this to be able to dream another day
Group Hug

[KT in CA]

I love SavingtheDream.org. And I love the ideas about the rentals and the job search. Both excellent ways to continue to provide help.

[Enough Already]

I think SavingtheDream.org is a great name too. I also like the concept. It sounds like it would have plenty to offer to every type of dreamer.

[Maurice Bedard]

Many thanks for the feedback everyone!

I know this thread got hijacked from the Professor but it would be nice if he provided some feedback here. The name change will have a huge effect on the community and some confusion with members. So, I am a bit worried.......

[snapple candy]

Moe,
I am sorry to to hear others trying to shut down the site but not surprised since it is open for any and all to view all of our comments. The powers that be operate this way all the time so they wont be held accountable for what they are doing that causes damages to others. For sure they dont want us strategizing on how to deal with them. The old conquer and divide strategy.

This site is great and has been a haven for me also. I would be sorely disappointed if it shut down and miss all the support I have gotten here. I have to agree what doesnt kill you, makes you stronger. That is a true sign of a "survivor". Better a survivor than a victim. Kick those big corporate attorneys butts!

[ProfessorShays]

Moe said, "I know this thread got hijacked from the Professor but it would be nice if he provided some feedback here."

Frankly I've racked my brain to come up with a site name that would meet the broad objectives of the forums on this site. My idea was I think good enough and available so I sent it to you Moe through the "contact us" form on the website. Let me know you got it.

Daniel

P.S. I'm sorry you were treated this way by First American. I had a lot of friends in the past who worked for them. They use to be a respected company in the industry. Sadly the industry as a whole has lost a lot of respect.

[tryingtostay]

Wow, the comments, ideas and thanks are what always make this place great. I am so glad that you have been able to process your thoughts with the education you have found here. You then made the best decsion for "you and your family" not the bank or your FICO! That is the best thing you could have ever done.

I agree with RimtoRim's post completely. I was devastated and depressed for months as I started this process. (LOL you can tell from reading my posts at 2am, etc, insomnia kicked in with the depression...hasn't left yet! my posts do not sound as intelligent as I know I am, sigh) Loansafe really kept me grounded and step back and separate my emotions from the house and evaluate the situation in a long term outlook. I could see that long term, things would not be good if there was no change. Loansafe gave me the tools to utilitize to empower myself; this empowerment helped rid the anxiety. I can honestly say when I stopped being depressed and anxious over the house, my children behaved better as I was more pleasant mom to them. My family life improved as I stopped being as drained over the entire process.

I knew our family was one of the millions out there experiencing this, but reading posts by the same people, day after day, going through the same thing, helped me feel connected and not alone. This community helped me find the inner strength to fight and take on the lender if I wanted to, but also helped me see the pointlessness of that action (in my situation).

I am sorry for the fight you have, Moe, but I really want to extend my deepest gratitude to you. Not only for starting this forum, but not giving up on this wonderful community when it is threatened. I am looking foward to continuing connecting with others in a "Life After Foreclosure" community. I can there imagine there will be posts on dealing with recourse debt collectors, the death of our FICOs, and living thriftly.

[baileys dad]

hello Moe,
any progress on the name change?
We should maybe start a new thread titled "The new loan safe" or something so we can get some input about the form of the new site...
I would like to see a forum dedicated to credit card debt and also one dealing with how to handle second mortgages...if a first loan modification is going to work, then it seems that we, as homeowners, need to look at all aspects of debt...
also a stronger "rebuilding credit" forum for those of us who will be starting over..
also, would like to thank the Professor for starting this dialogue...and all who have participated in a very spirited forum..

[Boneman]

Walk-a-Buy-Baby!

[Boneman]

That was a joke by the way...

How about ---LoanWolf---

Protection from predatory lenders!

[Enough Already]

Very funny, Boneman! I like both of those ideas.

[Maurice Bedard]

Professor -

Frankly I've racked my brain to come up with a site name that would meet the broad objectives of the forums on this site. My idea was I think good enough and available so I sent it to you Moe through the "contact us" form on the website. Let me know you got it.

Daniel

P.S. I'm sorry you were treated this way by First American. I had a lot of friends in the past who worked for them. They use to be a respected company in the industry. Sadly the industry as a whole has lost a lot of respect.

Thanks Daniel! I did get the email.

Baileys Dad - hello Moe,
any progress on the name change?
We should maybe start a new thread titled "The new loan safe" or something so we can get some input about the form of the new site...
I would like to see a forum dedicated to credit card debt and also one dealing with how to handle second mortgages...if a first loan modification is going to work, then it seems that we, as homeowners, need to look at all aspects of debt...

also a stronger "rebuilding credit" forum for those of us who will be starting over..

Great Ideas. I think tomorrow or Monday, I am going to rearrange the forums with these ideas in mind. I like the new loan safe idea thread where we can get feedback from everyone.

This thread was an awesome start.

TryingtoStay couldn't of said it better -

I knew our family was one of the millions out there experiencing this, but reading posts by the same people, day after day, going through the same thing, helped me feel connected and not alone. This community helped me find the inner strength to fight and take on the lender if I wanted to, but also helped me see the pointlessness of that action (in my situation).

I am sorry for the fight you have, Moe, but I really want to extend my deepest gratitude to you. Not only for starting this forum, but not giving up on this wonderful community when it is threatened. I am looking forward to continuing connecting with others in a "Life After Foreclosure" community. I can there imagine there will be posts on dealing with recourse debt collectors, the death of our FICOs, and living thriftly.

Sometimes I come to the forum and I just read the stories.

Before I had to post most the times because no one was sure if it was OK to help. Slowly a lot of you realized that helping new members is not just about giving the perfect answer but its about paying it forward by offering a hello or a "don't worry, were in this together!"

I just love how you all support one another. It's awesome to see people such as yourself TryingtoStay, empowering your life with hope and optimism in sometimes the darkest of days.

You are ALL my inspiration!

[Maurice Bedard]

Boneman - I like LoanWolf, that was cool.

This forum is really a Main Street support network and it is only natural to cover the other areas that are affecting us immensely. So, I am leaning towards SavingtheDream.org.

I feel we may all be here fighting for our dreams, homes, jobs and new lives for quite a while. For the past year and a half it has been about saving homes. Now, its helping people walk away with their heads up and then helping that same father or mother find a rental or job in a new town. We do not discriminate here...

It's about Americans rebuilding our lives together. One member, one post, one home, one job and one more person who now has found hope again !

[chasepmt2hot-firefighter]

What makes this forum any different from Dateline, 60 Minutes or 20/20? ABC, NBC & CBS have provided the public, informed positive and negative info for years. How about when reporters and camera crews chase people into their homes or cars asking questions? People have the opportunity to change the channel just like they can close out the forum. People read the TV guide not wanting to miss the programs. TIVO & DVR's were developed so the public can have a second chance on being informed. What is the difference? Programs are not cancelled because of high ratings. Forums continue because of activity. Yes, big lenders will feel threatened because they know the public is educating one another.
-----
Moe, if you need to change the name than who cares? I stumbled upon this forum searching by keywords for help. Others were referred... Not one person will miss out on the info you've provided. Change and secure the name, cover yourself from all directions and proceed. People will follow and seek out the archives. It's kinda like changing your e-mail address after 20 years. Send out a notice to everyone in your address book and be done with it. I'm looking forward to your new developed program. Bring it on...

[Boneman]

That's right--- We don't care what you call it, we are simply glad it's here and that it is a place where we can encourage one another and lend support. You've filled a great need and for that we are thankful.

When you think about it, having these financial folks force a name change on the little guy who is just trying to help--- well that too becomes part of the story of impersonal lenders without concern for folks "they" have put in situations without offering any real assistance now that their poor practices have collapsed on us.

They may wish to treat everyone like a number, but these are real people here.

Remember-- You are not a loan.

[RimToRimHiker]

Remember-- You are not a loan.

Good One!!!!

Re: the new forum, let's have a section dedicated to getting the word out about the cc companies that are using usury tactics on loyal customers who have paid their accounts as agreed (thank you Congress for allowing that to happen ). I'm all for boycotting the ones who are jacking up the interest rates and cutting the credit limits. So much for customer loyalty!!! So many stories out there where the creditor has been royally screwed because of a derogatory mark that had nothing to do with the cc company. If that cc account has not been paid as agreed, hey by all means raise the rates and cut the limits but if it's been paid as agreed then damnit leave it where it is. I have already decided that I will cease to use the cc of any company that does a usury on me. I won't close the account so the positive rating will remain on my credit report but the cc company will not be collecting the 3 or 4 or 5% service fee it collects on every purchase. Let's start putting the squeeze on the cc companies.