Green Tree Servicing made one offer to settle and then sent our loan to their Short Sale Dept.

[ssauburn]

We recently started following the process to settle our 2nd mortgage with green tree servicing who services our 2nd mortgage for bofa. We live in CA. Our loan amount is $140,000. They contacted us with an offer to settle for $104,000. We countered their offer at a figure much closer to what they might actually get in a short sale - after all other debts and fees are paid - about 3 percent of the loan balance.

Instead of sending us a new offer, they sent us a letter saying they have referred us to their short sale unit. We did not even mention short sale in our counter. I haven't seen this anywhere else in the threads, what should be our strategy at this point?

[Evan Bedard]

Instead of sending us a new offer, they sent us a letter saying they have referred us to their short sale unit. We did not even mention short sale in our counter. I haven't seen this anywhere else in the threads, what should be our strategy at this point?

It is common for the bank to get confused and send your file to the short sale department when inquiring about a settlement. However, they are not going to review your account for a short sale as you must provide all financial information so you really have nothing to worry about. 104k is a ridiculous offer and you should be able to settle for much less than that amount. I'm not sure if you have seen this thread already but you definitely will want to check it out if you have not done so already..

Strategy for Settling Your 2nd

[ssauburn]

It is common for the bank to get confused and send your file to the short sale department when inquiring about a settlement. However, they are not going to review your account for a short sale as you must provide all financial information so you really have nothing to worry about. 104k is a ridiculous offer and you should be able to settle for much less than that amount. I'm not sure if you have seen this thread already but you definitely will want to check it out if you have not done so already..

Strategy for Settling Your 2nd

Thank you for your input. We have read the thread you mentioned and started following the process. We let the phone ring for almost a year before they made the 1st offer. We are now waiting to see what their next one is.

[Evan Bedard]

Thank you for your input. We have read the thread you mentioned and started following the process. We let the phone ring for almost a year before they made the 1st offer. We are now waiting to see what their next one is.

No problem, you will have plenty of time negotiate a settlement as an underwater 2nd is in no position to pursue foreclosure. But I would not even consider attempting to settle the 2nd unless you have obtained an affordable solution on your 1st mortgage and are looking to keep your home.

[CalOkie]

No problem, you will have plenty of time negotiate a settlement as an underwater 2nd is in no position to pursue foreclosure. But I would not even consider attempting to settle the 2nd unless you have obtained an affordable solution on your 1st mortgage and are looking to keep your home.

Be careful with Green Tree - they told me they were going to settle and then did nothing after I sent my financials in. It was just to get my finance info.

[Evan Bedard]

Be careful with Green Tree - they told me they were going to settle and then did nothing after I sent my financials in. It was just to get my finance info.

If the 2nd mortgage is underwater Greentree is in no position to pursue foreclosure to collect on the debt and personally I would not supply them with any financial information to settle the account..

[fedupinpa]

Hi ssauburn,

Could you tell me a little more about your situation? I.e. the balance on first loan and the approx. value of your house?

I just stoppedy paying our second HELOC with Green Tree in May (it's currently 2 months past due). I am planning on following the strategy for settling a second. GT phoned me repeatedly, which I can deal with. However, they called me THREE times at work, even after I told them I absolutely cannot take personal calls at work. I ended up sending a cease and desist certified, which they received last week. Last night I got another phone call! I was pretty rude, informed the "account rep" of the c&d, and told her to update my account. The last thing she said was, "We will proceed then." Not sure what that meant, I'm guessing it was their attempt at a feeble threat.

I guess I'm just trying to figure out how long this will carry on. Did I read that you stopped paying for oer a year before they finally sent a settlement offer? Did you send in an offer first or did they initiate the settlement discussions?

My info:

1st, balance $16,000 - local bank, current
2nd HELOC - Green Tree, 2 months past due, balance $30,100
Approx. value of the home: $42,000
State: PA
Other: this is our first home that we couldn't sell, so it is currently rented; I don't give a rat's behind if we lose it, and I also don't place much emphasis on my credit score at this time.

[Evan Bedard]

1st, balance $16,000 - local bank, current
2nd HELOC - Green Tree, 2 months past due, balance $30,100
Approx. value of the home: $42,000
State: PA

Is your 1st mortgage's balance 16k or 160k?

[fedupinpa]

$16k. I previously thought that the second wasn't underwater, but a commentator on here pointed out that after adding foreclosure costs, legal fees, etc., GT is certainly underwater and not very likely to pursue FC.

I failed to mention that the housing market in my area is currently attrocious. This was a starter home, and houses like this and in this price range just are not selling. I think it would be safe to say that the house would sell anywhere between $35-40k.

[Evan Bedard]

$16k. I previously thought that the second wasn't underwater, but a commentator on here pointed out that after adding foreclosure costs, legal fees, etc., GT is certainly underwater and not very likely to pursue FC.

I failed to mention that the housing market in my area is currently attrocious. This was a starter home, and houses like this and in this price range just are not selling. I think it would be safe to say that the house would sell anywhere between $35-40k.

Yes that is very true after foreclosure fees it could easily cost them tens of thousands more dollars to complete the foreclosure and it is highly unlikely they will do so. If you read around you will find most people choose to wait for the servicer to make an offer before initiating negotiations..

[ssauburn]

Hi ssauburn,

Could you tell me a little more about your situation? I.e. the balance on first loan and the approx. value of your house?

I just stoppedy paying our second HELOC with Green Tree in May (it's currently 2 months past due). I am planning on following the strategy for settling a second. GT phoned me repeatedly, which I can deal with. However, they called me THREE times at work, even after I told them I absolutely cannot take personal calls at work. I ended up sending a cease and desist certified, which they received last week. Last night I got another phone call! I was pretty rude, informed the "account rep" of the c&d, and told her to update my account. The last thing she said was, "We will proceed then." Not sure what that meant, I'm guessing it was their attempt at a feeble threat.

I guess I'm just trying to figure out how long this will carry on. Did I read that you stopped paying for oer a year before they finally sent a settlement offer? Did you send in an offer first or did they initiate the settlement discussions?

My info:

1st, balance $16,000 - local bank, current
2nd HELOC - Green Tree, 2 months past due, balance $30,100
Approx. value of the home: $42,000
State: PA
Other: this is our first home that we couldn't sell, so it is currently rented; I don't give a rat's behind if we lose it, and I also don't place much emphasis on my credit score at this time.

Our first mortgage is $250,000, plus $10,000 in impounds. The first is with Chase and they can't seem to add two and two so our impound account keeps bouncing all over the place - hence the large balance due. Our second is $140,000. The value of our home is now about $297,000, down from a purchase price of $421,000 and a high value (we know it's over-inflated) of over $630,000. We won't be giving GT any financial information. We are waiting for a better offer from GT. We unplugged our home phone and so all contact has to be in writing. Fortunately we are retired so they can't call us at work. We figure that if we were to short sell the home, GT would get very little if anything after Chase, impounds, and fees are settled.

After a year of no pay, they sent us an offer. We have made a counter offer and haven't heard anything for about a month.

[Wanna be debt free]

Hi ssauburn:

Can you tell me when you stopped making payments? Was the first offer you received the $104K after a year? That's crazy. I've read that in most case it would have already been charged off at that point and they would be more willing to settle. Perhaps I have my information wrong. Also, do you have an update?

[ssauburn]

Sorry for the late post. One of the reasons we are trying to settle with GT besides having no equity to cover their loan is due to medical issues and bills. Kept us busy the last few weeks. Anyway, GT has now sent two letters within a couple of weeks of each other. The first offers us a payment plan for 5 years which would total about $97,000.00. The second is threatening a lawsuit. We are going to respond with a final offer to settle but we are seriously considering a short sale or walking away. GT ignored our first offer so we will have to wait and see what they do to this one.

[whiteface]

I was able to settle in December 2011 with Greentree for 10 percent of balance which was 200,000. I was persistent, relentless and felt victorious in the end. I had the 20,000 check wired after I received my paperwork.

I also got first mod done with BOA, trust me this was the worst battle of my life and one I will never forget. NEVER lose hope and keep trying.

[bubberrand]

Whiteface, you are the only one I've seen so far that has reached a settlement with them. I"m almost at the exact same dollar amount as the burn is. I'm over over a year on not paying them. I offered five percent, and they countered with some b.s. that put at about 95K still owing. It seems to me they are just kicking the can down the road and seeing if they can force anyone into paying. To anyone reading this, Greencrap can sue you, but it would be in violation of the state law if you are current on your first and that bad boy is underwater (they have to foreclose before they sue.) Doesn't mean they won't try it, but I haven't heard of it yet. Me, I'm ignoring their crap and playing the waiting game. Whiteface, congrats to you. Goes to show all their b.s. about not settling for small percentages of the loan balance is b.s.

[whiteface]

Read my other posts on this and hope it can help you. Wishing you all the best

Whiteface, you are the only one I've seen so far that has reached a settlement with them. I"m almost at the exact same dollar amount as the burn is. I'm over over a year on not paying them. I offered five percent, and they countered with some b.s. that put at about 95K still owing. It seems to me they are just kicking the can down the road and seeing if they can force anyone into paying. To anyone reading this, Greencrap can sue you, but it would be in violation of the state law if you are current on your first and that bad boy is underwater (they have to foreclose before they sue.) Doesn't mean they won't try it, but I haven't heard of it yet. Me, I'm ignoring their crap and playing the waiting game. Whiteface, congrats to you. Goes to show all their b.s. about not settling for small percentages of the loan balance is b.s.

[TomEason]

I was able to settle in December 2011 with Greentree for 10 percent of balance which was 200,000. I was persistent, relentless and felt victorious in the end. I had the 20,000 check wired after I received my paperwork.

I also got first mod done with BOA, trust me this was the worst battle of my life and one I will never forget. NEVER lose hope and keep trying.

Hi whiteface

Thanks for your post, and congratulations on that Dec 2011 GT settlement.

I don't recall if you posted your settlement saga in the Success Stories thread. If you haven't, would you mind doing so?

Thanks!

http://www.loansafe.org/forum/debt-settlement/40564-success-stories-settling-2nds.html

[bubberrand]

I should have put in my original post that if your residence is in California, the security first rule applies and they have to foreclose prior to a lawsuit. Course, if you are current on your first and it is underwater, they should be smart enough to figure out that they would be losing money. I know one person here on the boards that did get sued (wasn't by Greentree), and it got thrown out.

[StayOrGoInWAState]

Whiteface - did you provide financials to reach settlement with GT?

[whiteface]

Yes I had a two inch stack of documents for both GT and BOA - the issue is that you need to have your P&L reflect that magic 33 percent. It is all a numbers game, especially since I am self employed. Trust me when I say, I flooded them with docs, I had 96 pages submitted to BOA and numbered them so when they were in that phase of "we are missing page so and so" I grabbed it and had it faxed before the call ended. I kept a master set for me and sent them a copy so we both had the same thing.

Whiteface - did you provide financials to reach settlement with GT?

[ssauburn]

Whiteface

We have been contacted by GT and asked for financials to try and work out a settlement. Did you give them everything they asked for or did you decide what they could and couldn't have? The list provided over the phone sounded pretty invasive so I am having them send it to me. Any suggestions?

Yes I had a two inch stack of documents for both GT and BOA - the issue is that you need to have your P&L reflect that magic 33 percent. It is all a numbers game, especially since I am self employed. Trust me when I say, I flooded them with docs, I had 96 pages submitted to BOA and numbered them so when they were in that phase of "we are missing page so and so" I grabbed it and had it faxed before the call ended. I kept a master set for me and sent them a copy so we both had the same thing.

[ssauburn]

I guess I am confused. I have read a lot of posts that say don't give GT any paperwork. Why would all of this paperwork and the 33% be magical when the point isn't a refinance - it's an effort to settle for less than the loan amount. Our home has lost more than 1/3 of it's value from the original purchase price the day we bought it eight years ago. That doesn't include the additional money we spent in landscaping, etc. From the high point of the over influation of home prices we are down 54%. While the high point wasn't/isn't realistic, the bottom line is there still isn't any money for GT. If we walk away or short sale, GT isn't going to get anything and we are offering them at least something. Giving them my life's financial history for the past few years doesn't change that.

Whiteface

We have been contacted by GT and asked for financials to try and work out a settlement. Did you give them everything they asked for or did you decide what they could and couldn't have? The list provided over the phone sounded pretty invasive so I am having them send it to me. Any suggestions?

[bubberrand]

Do not give them any finanical info, period. If you are going to do that, you might as well go to Vegas and play blackjack with your cards facing out. Green Tree knows the Mortgage Debt Relief Act is expiring at the end of the year. I believe they are waiting to see how many people crack because they don't want to pay taxes on the forgiven debt. Plus, they have got nothing to lose. And they may be playing the odds on not caring if a few people get foreclosed on, or walk. They don't even contact me anymore because I've ignored all their futile attempts at getting me to pay, so now it is a matter of who is more stubborn (that would be me.)

[Housebroken13]

Interesting. Green Tree called my house today after over 2 years of zero contact. My loan has been charged off for almost 2 years at this point. I'm reluctant to call them back, and per state collection laws they can't leave me a voice mail. I blocked their number so if they want to reach out it will have to be in writing.

[LoriF]

Hi Whiteface! I couldn't find any of your old posts that explained your process with Greentree... can you tell me how you offered them the 10%? Our second (underwater, California as well) is for $210k. Over the phone they offered me $60,000 settlement within 3 minutes, but I declined and told them we only had $8000. I haven't heard from them since, and that was 3 months ago. Any advice would be helpful, as I was hoping to also settle for approximately 10%. Thanks so much, Lori

[TomEason]

Hi LoriF

Thanks for your post.

If the GT 2nd is underwater, they won't FC.

I recommend you no longer communicate with GT. Instead you might follow the guide at post #1 of the following thread.

Strategy for Settling Your 2nd

[whiteface]

It was actually pretty simple, I stood my ground and was late on my first. My thinking is that they feared I was going to go totally upside down and would rather accept 20 percent; than nothing at all. I made the offer, they accepted and sent them a cashiers check after I received their offer in writing. I would suggest being confident in your discussions with them, don't let them intimidate you. I also had help from the State Attorney General's office, the Governor's Office and two State Senators. I sent them endless letters asking for help explaining that I had to default in order to get their attention. I owed $400 on the first and $200K on the second.

I was deceived by BOA who did end up modifying my loan, they kept telling me it was in underwriting, it was being reviewed, encouraged me to pay and said if I didn't they would not review my mod which we all know is bs. I believed them, emptied my savings to stay current and took cash advances until I finally realized they were not even looking at my loan because I was current. I did get a VERY good mod and am extremely grateful, but it left me in cash advance h*ll so now am defaulting on BOA cc and will settle with them in a few months (stopped paying a few months ago). I have NO problem with defaulting on the cc because I was deceived in being encouraged to pay when they never had any intention to even look at my mod application.

Green Tree, after getting the letter from Senator's office, was more apt to settle they knew I had ALL my documents in order, I did submit financials, suffered hardship and was a poster child for this government program.

I have lived in my home 27 years, raised my family there, and have NO intention of leaving. My payments went from (first and second) at $4800 to now $1300 taxes and insurance inc. YES, there is hope, NEVER GIVE UP and keep all phone records, letters, emails and any supporting documents related. Involve your government officials.

My credit is shot not because of the Mod but now the cc. I have two other cc that I pay the moment I use them, and just hope for the best. I would rather have a home and food than pay a cc I was deceived.

I hope this helps you and others here as loansafe.org IS THE BEST.

[sumer]

Hello everybody,
My first mortgage is with WF and after few months of back and forward with the papaers for a loan modification finally I was approved for a trial period starting this month (I read and hear so many strange stories about this trial period that I am still skeptical with this loan modification. Banks playing us how they wanted and when they wanted, so I still have my reservation until.....IAN 2013)
My first mortgage is $427,000.00 (actual value is $290,000.00-$300,000.00) and the second mortgage is with......GT (investor is BOA), $108,000.00.
Please advice what should I do and if I can stope them to call me, how I can do it (they call me like 3-4 times/day). With first mortgage I am not late, but with second I am late 2 months. Can they forclosure my house ? can they sue me ? I am in California and I had a refinancing in 2006. Even if WF will aprove me for a final loan modification............second will be under water. What should I do ? Should I consult a lawyer to be prepare ? Should I answer the phone and see what options they have (they left me a message that they have options for me). I am interested to settle for 5-10% (no more then this)or..........to lower my actual interest (which is 12% at this time and mortgage is only interest). If they asking for financial doc...........what should I do ? (I'm thinking to not give them any financial information.
Advice will be really appreciate it.

[TomEason]

sumer

Thanks for your post.

Since your 2nd is underwater, they won't FC. I recommend you seek to eventually settle by following the guide at post #1 of the following thread. There's no hurry; you have lots of time. Patience is key.

Good luck.

Strategy for Settling Your 2nd

[sumer]

Thanks Tom
Yes, you're right: "PATIENCE IS THE KEY".......it is just feel like the strees to keeping my home and fight for this mortgages is not enought, my wife is stressing me out too, she's afraid to not get in problems and lose our house and she wants to pay. I told her....well lets wait few months more(at list until jan-feb next year) and we'll see what will happen.
Anyway I will post here the results for first mortgage anfd for second.
Best luck to everybody and don't give up and fight all the way to the end.

[LoriF]

Thanks Whiteface. We're in a similar situation, we got our loan modified with BofA two years ago but they wouldn't modify our second, so we stopped paying on it and it got transferred to Greentree in Feb. Within 3 minutes they had come down to 65k from 210k total. Can you tell me where I mail my letter, and do you possibly have a form version of it? Did you send it certified? We have to get this off our credit so we can move to another school district. I don't want to be a renter again, or if so, not forever!

Thanks again,
Lori

[TomEason]

LoriF

Thanks for your post.

Since you evidently have an overriding reason to settle soon, you might be prepared to jump through some hoops, and to pay more for a settlement. If their offer of $65K is acceptable, then so be it. If it's worth it to you to settle for that amount, go for it.

How hard can it be to ask your lender contact for the correct/best address?

[LoriF]

Whiteface,

GT has agreed to settle for 10%. If we do it now we won't be taxed on it (end of the year this ends). Can you tell me what your agreement with them was in terms of reporting to the credit agencies? They told me that they can't legally delete the record...

[whiteface]

I am not sure what yuo mean about not being taxed on it as it is my understanding everyone who has been down this road does get a 1099 at the end of the year, I did.

I got a letter from them stating what we agreed upon, got a cashiers check and overnighted it to them. They report me paid in full, less than agreed which makes sense.

Best of luck to you!

Whiteface,

GT has agreed to settle for 10%. If we do it now we won't be taxed on it (end of the year this ends). Can you tell me what your agreement with them was in terms of reporting to the credit agencies? They told me that they can't legally delete the record...

[bubberrand]

I am not sure what yuo mean about not being taxed on it as it is my understanding everyone who has been down this road does get a 1099 at the end of the year, I did.

I got a letter from them stating what we agreed upon, got a cashiers check and overnighted it to them. They report me paid in full, less than agreed which makes sense.

Best of luck to you!

I think she means it will fall under the Mortgage Debt Relief Act. However being it is a 2nd, unless it was purchase money which few were, she will still get hit with a 1099. I think a lot of people forget about that bit of nastiness when they settle. It's nice to see Greencrud settle for 10 percent;. Maybe someday I'll get to settle for 10% too. Until then, the rubberband no pay.

[Wanna be debt free]

Lori:

Can you add when you first defaulted with GT as well as if you provided financials to get to the 10 percent? I was hoping to see how long your process was as well as if you followed the strategy or provided financials. I'm about 6 months behind and being pressured to provide financials, which I really want to avoid, however I have reasons for trying to get this resolved sooner rather than later.

Thanks!

Nicole

[tony1151]

They are still pusuing me for unforgiven debt on a short sale even though they got.50 on a doolar of the amount owed when the first lender kicked in an amount to them. It's been 2 1/2 years since the sale. Don't know what their legal rigt is but they did send paper work saying they were not forgiving debt in short sale process.

[sumer]

Hello again,
On post #30 I said that I will be back, and here I am with the news. I got approved for the loan modification with WF (first mortgage). I did pass the trial period and from Jan 3 2013 I will pay the new monthly payment for first mortgage (the new payment is with $1100 less and the interest is 3.25 % for 5 years and after will be 3.35%). Now, I have to continue the fight with the second mortgage, with GT (investor is BoA). I get calls every day but I don't answer and I'm late with the payments 5 months. What should I do ? To try to settle with GT for 3-5 % or max 10% ? Or try to settle directly with the investor (BoA). Or wait for ....forgiveness ? GT can not forclosure my house (I want to mention that I want to keep the house) because even with the loan modification the house still is underwater, at this time I still owe WF $429,000.00.............the value of the house is like $300,000.00, but over 3 years WF will forgive $70,000, (if I'll make the payments in time in this 3 years. As is now I don't pay for the $70,000.00..............the monthly payment (include the escrow) is only for $359.000.00. BUT........I think GT can sue me.
Please advise what should I do ? Can DOJ apply in my case and get a letter of forgiveness ? I will pay 1099 if I will settle in 2013 ?

Thank you.......MERRY CHRISTMAS AND A HAPPY NEW YEAR TO EVERYBODY !


P.S. I won a fight, but not the WAR...YET. So, keep fighting for the second now.

[bubberrand]

Good luck on settling with Greencrap. The best I ever got them to agree to was knocking $25,000 of the $135,000 that I owed them. After negotiations fell apart, we don't talk to each other anymore. I think they are playing the waiting game. Fine by me. When they become a sold-out jr. loan and get nothing, they will only have themselves to blame. GT can't sue you in CA. They have to foreclose first, which they won't do because it would cost them money.