Help - Just Approved

[EvanstonARK]

Hello All.

So I got a surprise in the mail today. After nearly exactly 45 days (who knew they would have been so accurate) I just received a FedEx from BofA.

It basically said, "Thank you for recently taking time to speak with us and for providing a portion of you financial information in order to start your three-month trial period for your mortgage loan modification...." "For a three-month trial period, instead of making your existing mortgage payment, you will now make the new trial period mortgage payment of X. Your next step in the process is to make the first month's trial period mortgage payment of X today." "In the next few days, you wil receive a package with additional details and documents that you need to return...."

Now, the offer that they made for me, while definitely a help, is not at the 31% that should have been offered. Actually, it would be 31% if they excluded my HOA which it seems they might have.

Do I have any recourse negotiating this initial offer lower? Can I talk to someone?

Thank you very much for your expert advice and I hope all of you receive packages like this ASAP.

[heidi79]

The initial trial offer for the HAMP modification is only sent once. If the trial payment is something that is going to help you, my all means you should consider accepting it.

The payment should be 31% of your gross income - of course your hoa fee, since that's paid apart. If you think the amount was miscalculated, call them to try to fix this before they draw up the paperwork. If there are any issues, we're seeing they are caught in the underwriting process and the permanent modification may in fact be lower.

[ama125]

I just talked to my negotiator today as I am awaiting a FedEx packet and wanted to find out what it is that I should be receiving. He told me a letter exactly as you are describing and that the trial payment is typically higher than what the true modified payment will be. If it was way off, I'd try to get it corrected. If it's in the ballpark and you can swing it, then I wouldn't push the issue. It's your call.

[yomann]

Congratulations on getting a trial offer is so short a period of time.
As others have said, if your HOA dues are not that high, just go with the offer, and request they take a 2nd look for the final mod.
In many cases (as posted on the forums) the Final mod usually ends up with a lower monthly payment.

[EvanstonARK]

Thanks for the quick replies.

I have been trying for MONTHS to even get past the gatekeepers at CW. However, I was one of the people who haven't missed a payment, so I "obviously" wasn't facing financial difficulties. HA! I finally got through to someone to submit my paperwork and they told me 30-45 days...which actually came true.

Not including the HOA IS a big deal to us. The payment is roughly $315/month which given the gross income comes to a little over 8%. It looks like all they did was take my gross and multiply by .31 to come up with my mortgage payment and paid no attention to my HOA. Hopefully it should be an easy fix?

[ama125]

Originally Posted by EvanstonARK

Thanks for the quick replies.

I have been trying for MONTHS to even get past the gatekeepers at CW. However, I was one of the people who haven't missed a payment, so I "obviously" wasn't facing financial difficulties. HA! I finally got through to someone to submit my paperwork and they told me 30-45 days...which actually came true.

Not including the HOA IS a big deal to us. The payment is roughly $315/month which given the gross income comes to a little over 8%. It looks like all they did was take my gross and multiply by .31 to come up with my mortgage payment and paid no attention to my HOA. Hopefully it should be an easy fix?

That is EXACTLY what they do to determine the trial amount... I confirmed by phone today what my trial payment will be and it is exactly 31% of GMI but my nego told me what he expects the modified payment amount to be and is lower than the trial payment. Time will tell. I don't know that you'll be able to get it changed, but can't hurt to try.

[heidi79]

the hoa issue is a little different as opposed to people who have homeowners insurance, you still have to recieve a reduction to allow for the hoa. it SHOULD be an easy fix!

[EvanstonARK]

Originally Posted by ama125

That is EXACTLY what they do to determine the trial amount... I confirmed by phone today what my trial payment will be and it is exactly 31% of GMI but my nego told me what he expects the modified payment amount to be and is lower than the trial payment. Time will tell. I don't know that you'll be able to get it changed, but can't hurt to try.

Thank you very much for your opinion. I don't mean to be rude, but I don't think you understand what I was asking. Congratulations on your acceptance though!

[EvanstonARK]

While the mortgage payment was lowered to 31% of my gross income, it did not include my HOA. So in essence, they only dropped it to 38%. As was mentioned by another poster it SHOULD be an easy fix for them to change the amount.

The mortgage payment should really be about 23% with 8% being the HOA that isn't paid to the lender...at least according to HAMP. Correct?

[davephx]

Originally Posted by EvanstonARK

While the mortgage payment was lowered to 31% of my gross income, it did not include my HOA. So in essence, they only dropped it to 38%. As was mentioned by another poster it SHOULD be an easy fix for them to change the amount.

The mortgage payment should really be about 23% with 8% being the HOA that isn't paid to the lender...at least according to HAMP. Correct?

Confusing... but yes the HOA is in the front end DTI where they are supposed to get down to 31% but...

Front-End DTI is the ratio of the Principal, Interest, Taxes and Insurance Payments (PITIA) to the Monthly Gross Income. PITIA is defined under the program as principal, interest, taxes, insurance (including homeowners insurance and hazard and flood insurance) and homeowners association and condominium fees. Mortgage insurance premiums (PMI Insurance) are excluded from the PITIA calculation.

The Front-End DTI Target is 31%. The Standard Waterfall step that results in a Front-End DTI closest to 41%, without going below 31%, will satisfy the Front-End DTI Target. There is no restriction on reducing Front-End DTI below 31%, but any portion of the reduction below 31% will not be covered by the Payment Reduction Cost Share offered by the Treasury.

[grullagirl]

Originally Posted by davephx

Confusing... but yes the HOA is in the front end DTI where they are supposed to get down to 31% but...

Front-End DTI is the ratio of the Principal, Interest, Taxes and Insurance Payments (PITIA) to the Monthly Gross Income. PITIA is defined under the program as principal, interest, taxes, insurance (including homeowners insurance and hazard and flood insurance) and homeowners association and condominium fees. Mortgage insurance premiums (PMI Insurance) are excluded from the PITIA calculation.

The Front-End DTI Target is 31%. The Standard Waterfall step that results in a Front-End DTI closest to 41%, without going below 31%, will satisfy the Front-End DTI Target. There is no restriction on reducing Front-End DTI below 31%, but any portion of the reduction below 31% will not be covered by the Payment Reduction Cost Share offered by the Treasury.

Just a thought, while I realize that HOA dues are a part of the monthly expenses of a household. Those dues usually cover things, at a minimum, like paint, roof, outside landscape, irrigation water for the landscape, etc. These are items that a home in a non-HOA property pay over and above any PITI. Also a lot of HOA's cover most of the catastrophic insurance. Under HAMP this is supposed to be included in the payment. Point is, those not in HOA's would have to budget over and above their monthly mortgage payment for any maintenance items.

[davephx]

The difference is the HOA can file a lien against the property vs if you pay the similar comparable expenses directly. That is why it makes sense to be part of piti..and hoa

This protects the mortgage investor from impairment because of a HOA lien to be sure it is paid and part of the piti.

[MyHAMP]

I'm not even sure it has anything to do with the HOA. Could also be a coincidence.

Please keep in mind that the trial-payments are almost ALWAYS higher than the permanent modified payments which are supposed to be 31% of gross.

On average, trial is 10% higher.

[davephx]

Originally Posted by MyHAMP

Please keep in mind that the trial-payments are almost ALWAYS higher than the permanent modified payments which are supposed to be 31% of gross. On average, trial is 10% higher.

Hmmmm I had not noticed that but haven't look for it the too few success stories!

[AZOwner]

Thank you all for posting. We have a larger initiative going on to provide the American Homeowner a voice to get the system in some kind of order.

Please, Please, go to the Huffington article and post a message to the article, link above. We need to bring this fight back to the forefront. If you won't sign the petition, please leave a note at Huffington. Highlight some of your challenges with the issues.

Together we can make a BIG difference, individually we are a drop in the bucket.

Thank you.

Here are links to both.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/richar..._b_342665.html

http://www.petition2congress.com/2/2564/petition-to-us-government-from-american-homeowners/

[grullagirl]

Originally Posted by davephx

The difference is the HOA can file a lien against the property vs if you pay the similar comparable expenses directly. That is why it makes sense to be part of piti..and hoa

This protects the mortgage investor from impairment because of a HOA lien to be sure it is paid and part of the piti.

Any HOA lien would be jr. to a first or second lender. But I do agree with your point.
It would be interesting to know if those properties in an HOA are harder to qualify for a HAMP modification. I would bet that if, say, my home was in an HOA with even a $300 a month dues pmt, my numbers wouldnt' have worked. Also, keeping in mind that the escrowed amount inc. any HOA could vary by quite a bit. HOA dues are only going to go up! And some signficantly, factoring in all of the dues that have gone unpaid and then the home goes back to the bank. Those dues are extinguished. An HOA, by CA law, can increase the dues by 20% per year without a vote of the members. A special assessment can also be levied and assessed to each owner under certain circumstances. Most HOA's are underfunded and most likely are looking at deferred maintenance. Meaning a dues increase and possible assessment. A modified payment under the HAMP could vary by quite a bit each year due to the HOA.

[Skipper]

Originally Posted by ama125

I just talked to my negotiator today as I am awaiting a FedEx packet and wanted to find out what it is that I should be receiving. He told me a letter exactly as you are describing and that the trial payment is typically higher than what the true modified payment will be. If it was way off, I'd try to get it corrected. If it's in the ballpark and you can swing it, then I wouldn't push the issue. It's your call.

Hi Ama,

I just received this letter (via FEDEX) yesterday afternoon. It gave the payment amount and included a payment coupon.

I am curious, did your negotiator say why it asks for a payment "today", and then also references the MHA documents that will be coming "soon"?

I have a call into my negotiator, but I have not heard from her as of yet. I would appreciate (as always!) any insight you may have!

Regards and congratulations on your progress!

Skipper

[nmwadam]

Originally Posted by Skipper

Hi Ama,

I just received this letter (via FEDEX) yesterday afternoon. It gave the payment amount and included a payment coupon.

I am curious, did your negotiator say why it asks for a payment "today", and then also references the MHA documents that will be coming "soon"?

I have a call into my negotiator, but I have not heard from her as of yet. I would appreciate (as always!) any insight you may have!

Regards and congratulations on your progress!

Skipper

I recieved the same letter on October 15th. I sent my payment the 16th and received my package yesterday. The first payment due date is for 12/01/09, the second is for 01/01/10 and the third is 02/01/10. The reason I was given is that when the letter was generated the dates were not set in the system yet.

[Skipper]

Originally Posted by nmwadam

I recieved the same letter on October 15th. I sent my payment the 16th and received my package yesterday. The first payment due date is for 12/01/09, the second is for 01/01/10 and the third is 02/01/10. The reason I was given is that when the letter was generated the dates were not set in the system yet.

Thanks,

Did you make a payment for November? Or Just mid-October (with December being next?)?

Skipper

[nmwadam]

[QUOTE=Skipper;148418]Thanks,

Did you make a payment for November? Or Just mid-October (with December being next?)?

Skipper[/Q

I sent in the first payment which will be applied to the December payment date, I make my next payment for January 1st.

I actually called them and made them send me an email confirming the dates so that I have a record that I was told this information from a Bank of America person in writing.

[Skipper]

[QUOTE=nmwadam;148546]

Originally Posted by Skipper

Thanks,

Did you make a payment for November? Or Just mid-October (with December being next?)?

Skipper[/Q

I sent in the first payment which will be applied to the December payment date, I make my next payment for January 1st.

I actually called them and made them send me an email confirming the dates so that I have a record that I was told this information from a Bank of America person in writing.

Thanks,

I spoke to them today, and they said that i could take the payment coupon to a local branch and make the payment there.

Once the first payment is in the system, then (apparently) the documents pertaining to the remaining two (or three?) payments is sent out (the infamous "FEDEX" drill!).

I am going to make my payment today, and we will see how long it takes for the final trial documents to actually show up.

Any thoughts?

Skipper

[jojolala]

I am sooooo suspicious of this letter. The one page letter is so marketing-like. I received the same one yesterday. We have been in forebearance since Dec08, and stopped paying the negotiated lower payment as of September because they have $14,000 of ours in an escrow account and have given us no indication they will reduce our principal (deal breaker for us).

"Thank you for providing a portion of your financial information in order to start your three-month trial period" tells me that they are washing their hands of any prior correspondence and conversation, and that they are just trying to pry open our tightly closed fists.

The repeated use of "pay today" is slick and stinks of blackmail. To send the banksters more money now would be a great leap of faith we are not willing to make. Especially now that I'm reading the promised package with "additional details and documents" are only sent once this money is received.

Nothing tells me the "additional details" will be specific mod terms. In fact they say that the next round of docs will only "determine our eligibility for the permanent mod of our loan".

No more money from us BAC....