Modification? Forebearance? I'll Flip a Coin!

[snapple candy]

I did the same a couple months ago and only just last week got a standard letter thanks for your comments bs. I dont know who really reads those or if anything done about what we write to them.Peggy, is you loan a fannie mae backed one? If so, hold their feet to the fire with exact language out of the guidelines. That is what I am doing.

[Calli09]

For those of you who are now on the 3 month trial mod situation, I have 2 questions. Please advise.

Where do we send our #2 and #3 pmts? The Fedex pkg I got gave the initial pmt to go to CT. I sent it, but the pkg never explained where to send the remaining 2 pmts. My original pmts have always gone to AZ, Chase Home Finance, LLC. I called the # in the Fedex pkg, and they said to send to either place, and it will record. Any thoughts?

Also, I am wondering about the bank's portion of the modification process. Do I understand correctly that upon us signing the papers for this, as many of us have already done, the bank gets $1500 immediately? Makes me wonder, as if they decide not to modify after the 3 mo trial, and they have already taken the pmt of $1500 from the Obama plan, isn't this fraud? Do they have to then give the $1500 back? Maybe they do not get the money until they actually give the mod? Curious about this one.

[Moe Bedard]

No payments under the program to the lender/investor, servicer, or borrower will be made during the Trial Period. No payments under the program to the lender/investor, servicer, or borrower will be made if the Trial Period is not completed successfully. No payments under the program to the lender/investor, servicer, or borrower will be made unless and until the servicer has entered into the program agreements with Treasury’s financial agent.

The Trial Period will last 90 days (three payments at modified terms) or longer if necessary to comply with investor contractual obligations. The borrower must be current at the end of the Trial Period to obtain a Home Affordable Modification.

Upon a modification becoming effective following successful completion of the Trial Period by a borrower who was current prior to the start of the Trial Period, lenders/investors will be paid a $1,500 Current Borrower One-Time Incentive, subject to certain de minimis constraints (discussed below).

No monthly lender/investor payments will be made during the Trial Period. Monthly lender/investor payments will begin after the Trial Period is successfully completed, the servicer signs a service agreement with Treasury, and formal modification begins. No monthly lender/investor payments will be made if the Trial Period is not completed successfully.

[snapple candy]

How do we find out of the "servicer" has entered into the program agreements with the treasury? Or is this done on a case by case basis per borrower?

Id like to read a sample "servicer agreement".

"Monthly lender/investor payments will begin after the Trial Period is successfully completed, the servicer signs a service agreement with Treasury, and formal modification begins."

So you can still successfully complete the trial period and the lender can still deny modification. Note: "and formal modification begins". Nothing about completed. All this is just to get the incentives. Not to be the cynic, they get to collect 3 mths of payments from you, pretend to go thru modification process, Collect the $1500 for successful completion of trial period, then deny your modification or offer you one that is not affordable that you have to turn down.

[Moe Bedard]

they do not receive the money just upon a successful Trial
Modification.........

Upon a modification becoming effective following successful completion of the Trial Period by a borrower who was current prior to the start of the Trial Period, lenders/investors will be paid a $1,500 Current Borrower One-Time Incentive, subject to certain de minimis constraints (discussed below).

No monthly lender/investor payments will be made during the Trial Period. Monthly lender/investor payments will begin after the Trial Period is successfully completed, the servicer signs a service agreement with Treasury, and formal modification begins. No monthly lender/investor payments will be made if the Trial Period is not completed successfully.


The contracts are located here under Making Home Affordable Program
FinancialStability.gov | U.S. Department of the Treasury

[Calli09]

Thank you ***. This brings me to believe that my Obama mod will not go thru, as I was not current prior to the trial. I missed March pmt, (upon Chase's suggestion) and April was the 1st pmt of the trial, so since I missed March, and was not current upon the beginning of the trial, where is Chase's incentive to work with me on this? I may be spinning my wheels and ruining my credit during this trial if they will deny. I can only keep my fingers crossed at this point.

Also, if anyone knows where they plan to mail their 2nd and 3rd pmts, please advise.

Thank you for all the good advice here, it really helps.

[Kalvin09]

Calli09:

Obama plan applies even you missed a payment......last few days, when I was calling the 3rd party at Chase(Home Retention Dept), they have advised that if you are current before getting on to the trial period, you will be reported as current......Before I used to get different answers from this department for this question but now everyone gives the same answer, which makes me think that atleast they have made a decision on how to go forward with people who are current...

Regarding the 2nd and 3rd payments, they have told me to send the payments to the regular mortgage payment location. Only the 1st payment goes to Home Retention department along with other documents.

Keep us updated on your progress.....

[Calli09]

Just curious. Is the 31% supposed to include PMI? Bought the house in 07, and it has PMI. My question is, if the 31% is supposed to include the PMI, at what time, under the Obama plan, is this supposed to fall off? Or, if using the Obama plan, is the PMI is no longer in the calculation? ***, or anyone, if you could shed some light on this, it would be appreciated. Thank you for all the comments, and help out there.

[Moe Bedard]

Front-End DTI is the ratio of PITIA to Monthly Gross Income. PITIA is defined as principal, interest, taxes, insurance (including homeowners insurance and hazard and flood insurance) and homeowners association and/or condominium fees. Mortgage insurance premiums are excluded from the PITIA calculation.

[Calli09]

So will I have to add that on top of whatever mod they give me, or is the PMI considered a mute point on the Obama plan? The way I see mine figured so far, is 31% of my current gross income. Does PMI get added on top of the 31%, just to be taken off at a later date, or is this an entirely new calculation? Or, is it that when you reach the 80% mark, they take off PMI, if it is added to the total? Still confused.

[Calli09]

Actually, I kind of think they put the pmi in their 31% calculation, how would I know whether or not they did???? Accordingly, I am not a trusting individual where Chase is concerned, and do not want to sign papers that have added more than they should have, if you know what I mean, even if its only $55 or so. It still all adds up.

[Moe Bedard]

PMI would not be calculated to get you to the target of the 31% of gross income.............so it would be separate.

If the PMI was put in the 31% payment by mistake..........then that would be in your favor.

Try using the calculator here in this link and put in your info..........
Making Home Affordable - Payment Reduction Estimator

[Calli09]

Well, let the games begin!! I just opened my email today to find that my American Express Card line of credit has been reduced down to exactly $94 less than the balance. It gave the crapola about the economic times, etc. I called and pitched a you know what! I have never been late paying, and have paid more than the min. So here we go! I know the real reason as all of you should here too. Its the loan mod. The loan mod is beginning to trash my credit before I even make the 2nd trial pmt! I am so pissed. I told the guy that now they lowered my balance so low that if I do not pay it off, it will wind up getting late charges on it just due to my balance. They took away almost $3600 of available credit and left me with none. So in other words, just cancel the card lady. I am not stupid, I know if I cancel it will only make my fico score go down, so no one needs to warn me of that, but geez, this sucks. Also, if they had left the interest rate where they said it was going to be instead of continually inching it up and up, it would not be where it is today. Feel like not making any more pmts to them now.....ugh! I have another card, they have not done this yet, but I bet its just around the corner. My new statement will be cut the end of May, so, let the games begin! Just makes me mad when they mess with someone who has never missed a beat payment wise. You know, what the? Never ever 1 late pmt. This loan mod I am sure is going to trash my credit big time! Thanks for listening. Wish there was a good CC forum. I am so bummed.

[smit5454]

BOA just jacked up my interest rate a few months ago, long before I started the mod process. I have amex too, so I am sure the will do the same. If my trial mod packet ever shows up, I am going to cash advance the remaining credit I have and stick it in a money market account in case I need it. I know the interest rate is high, but that cash cushion makes a bigger difference to me at least short term until I start to get this house straight.

[fauve]

Calli, that sucks.

Thanks for the heads up. They told me they dinged credit because so many loan mods ended up in default. This approach will just increase that trend, because with credit screwed up anyway where's the motivation to make mortgage payments on an upsie-down house? The banks are run by total idiots.

[smit5454]

This must be my packet I have been promised for weeks! He's getting out of the truck, he's walking....... to my next door neighbors house, and he's................. driving off again without a delivery for me for the 90th time. Thanks Chase!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Calli09]

Hello everyone, and thanks for the support! I am peeved about the AMEX to say the least, it really bummed me out. I have not even used the card for a few months now, and they have checked the stats and seen that I used other credit and they probably got pissed, and said well lets do this and dump her! See by taking away all the excess credit I had on the card, even though I still have never defaulted in any way, my fico will dive, because its your available credit vs. the used credit vs. the payment history that makes up the fico or shall I say fuc-- score! So they punished me for paying on time, whether they admit it or not, and they know it.

Take the Chase situation, and now what AMEX has done, I have not gotten my latest fuc_o score yet, but sure enough, its a downer!!

Honestly, part of me just wants to file BK and start over, although I never imagined I would even think that. After all this bank bailout crap, I am of a different mindset, and after the antics of Chase, Amex, and who know who else will join them, I will be ruined anyway, so why not wipe the slate clean? I wonder if I did file BK, if in the end my mod would wind up being better than 31%? I know if I did file now it would end all efforts up to this point, or wait to see what kind of mod gets proposed, then file BK on the CC. I truly am upset, as my credit history goes way back, and this is a travesty to say the least!!

[snapple candy]

B of A did the same to me but they simply just cancelled the card on me when it was the only one I had. This all happened when I was trying to get an unauthorized charge by a hotel reversed when I needed a cash advance. I told them I had been current on the payments and this is only card I had. They didnt care. I had to have a friend add me on as a card holder to get myself a credit card.
All the CC companies reviewing cards and doing this and have been for months. AMEX did the same to a friend a few months ago but she also had way too much revolving credit going too but had a tidy sum in bank. Sometimes BK does look good. Not sure really how much latitude BK judges have when it comes to setting mortgage payments just yet. Threatening Chase with BK might be useful in your mod. Have you talked to a BK attorney? might want to get a consult to find out what your options are in the event you go down that road.

[CW California]

Originally Posted by Calli09

Hello everyone, and thanks for the support! I am peeved about the AMEX to say the least, it really bummed me out. I have not even used the card for a few months now, and they have checked the stats and seen that I used other credit and they probably got pissed, and said well lets do this and dump her! See by taking away all the excess credit I had on the card, even though I still have never defaulted in any way, my fico will dive, because its your available credit vs. the used credit vs. the payment history that makes up the fico or shall I say fuc-- score! So they punished me for paying on time, whether they admit it or not, and they know it.

Take the Chase situation, and now what AMEX has done, I have not gotten my latest fuc_o score yet, but sure enough, its a downer!!

Honestly, part of me just wants to file BK and start over, although I never imagined I would even think that. After all this bank bailout crap, I am of a different mindset, and after the antics of Chase, Amex, and who know who else will join them, I will be ruined anyway, so why not wipe the slate clean? I wonder if I did file BK, if in the end my mod would wind up being better than 31%? I know if I did file now it would end all efforts up to this point, or wait to see what kind of mod gets proposed, then file BK on the CC. I truly am upset, as my credit history goes way back, and this is a travesty to say the least!!

Were you ever late on your mortgage? Were you in a forebearance? Is that why they reported negatively? If so, maybe you can get it reversed.

[Calli09]

CW California,
No, never late until March, when it was "suggested" by Chase. I was not in forebearance. I am now on trial mod, until june, then july is to begin mod, terms currently unknown. As for the cc, never late, ever. Still to date, never late ever.

[Calli09]

Update, yesterday's mail gave me a copy of my MHA agreement back, with a the signature line filled in by a Chase associate. So I take it they have accepted the mod, provided I make the next 2 pmts on time. My only apprehension is that they will change their tune and go much higher. The actual mod trial pmts I am currently making are only a small amount lower than my original, thats probably why they signed. I am wondering if I can reach someone I can actually discuss the "workout" terms with, so that at the end of this I am not sent something in the mail they want me to finalize and sign off on in 2 days or something like that. Any thoughts? Has anyone else gotten their copy back yet signed? Kind of feeling like somehow I could have done better with these numbers. Is there a chance they could still offer me something lower than the trial pmts?

Just wondering if they really have the numbers right on mine.

I also was reading on some other post that Chase is sending out incorrect papers, and that our mods may be dead in the water??? That Chase is trying to return TARP funds or something?

[Calli09]

Question, so if PMI is not supposed to be a calculation in the MHA quotient, does that mean if given the mod you would no longer be paying PMI? Still did not really get an answer on that one. Please advise me. Thank you.

[snapple candy]

Calli,
My understanding is this PMI will be included in the mods. I havent received one of these agreements back but I strongly urge you to have an attorney review it before you do. I have heard on some of the threads, that some of the language they have found is "shady".
I heard about this incorrect papers trhowing a wrench in Chase mods but it was only just a few days ago and I have kept up on the blogs for a couple days. If you poke around some, youll find someone talking about that issue.
I understand several of the lenders trying to repay or return TARP funds cuz they dont like govt telling them what to do. I hear thaey are not getting anywhere with that one just yet.

[antel]

Hi Calli09

I don't know if I understood you correct. But you are on the trial pmts and they already sent you the copy of the final mod? I'm also getting close to end of the trial payment. i have already made 2 pmnts and will be making the last payment next week. Did you receive you actual mod already? Was it higher or lower than the trial payment? Now that its close to the end, I'm really scared and so stressed again. Can you please.....

[Calli09]

Hello all, Antel, sorry to worry you, no what I received, and what I understand we all should receive, is an actual copy of what we sent to them, just a copy of what we signed, but with their signature filled in. The mod terms are not on it, because its just a signed copy of what I already signed for the trial mod only. If you read through your fedex pkg, you will see where they are supposed to be sending everyone a copy signed by them, or a letter with a reason why the mod is denied. So, I am still at the same stage as everyone really, with the same questions, etc that everyone else has. Hope this helped. If not, read thru your docs, you will see the part where they will be sending you back a signed copy of yours.