Status of Chase acquisition of WAMU loans

[norcalstuck]

Hiya, I have posted most of my information on the Wheel, but this is Chase specific. Today, a CSR told us that the Chase acquisition of WAMU mortgages was fully closed and FDIC approved. Only the bank account business is still pending, anyone know if that is accurate?

Our original first was WAMU, still the only recorded deed and shows WAMU as beneficiary. We are just trying to find leverage to challenge Chase when they foreclose. We have a HAMP app on and now they are asking us to submit it all over again. Fine, hopefully puts off NOD a bit longer.

Thanks, now back to the Wheel game.

[Annie Mac]

These are really muddy waters....and it would have been, still would be helpful to get a clearer picture of the framework. My first and second were Wamu, and the second was signed off before Chase came on the scene. I never had a Wamu bank account. According to the county records, Wamu holds the papers. When Chase took over, it seemed to create a six month delay and everything being redone. But, papers have been lost on both sides of the aisle. Wamu was so disorganized, while Chase is disorganized in more of a pattern. Some days I wonder if a reason my file is in year three is because so many errors and illegalities were made by Wamu that it is just not clear and never will be on that end. However, it is pretty clear to me.

[norcalstuck]

Yes it is very muddy. We had WAMU on first, then WAMU offered to extend our IO5 year loan for Another 5 years, but the rate increased thus adding $1000 more per month. But that was in 2008, Sept, literally days before the FDIC losed them. Chase cannot produce a copy of that 2008 extension/modification. Yet they have no problem being able to push us through foreclosure, even though WAMU is still beneficiary, with calif reconveyance company, owned by WAMU, as trustee. I am sure we will never know how illegal and fraudulent that business is. Still would like to know if FDIC approved Chase purchase of all WAMU assets. Be well

[Annie Mac]

I have been doing some digging, and the details are pushing the learning curve up a steep hill. Evidently, when my new, revised, even better than before ARM was offered by Wamu,in 2007, Washington Mutual Bank,FA no longer existed (as of April 2005) My contract lists Washington Mutual Bank as the lender. My second was also with Wamu, and was charged off in 2008. In 2010, Chase filed a substitution on the second, as the new lender over WamuFA and WamuBank. None of these seem to be on record with MERS at this point, but the loan number of the first has changed three times now in all the switches of lender. Do you know anything about these fine details of name with Wamu?

[freedomwon]

Annie Mac - If you haven't done so already, take a little trip to the county recorders office & get yourself copies of all documents that have been filed on your property since loan origination. It helps to see the chronological order in which things were filed, who the signers are on the documents, who the notary is etc etc. It's just good info to have!

Norcalstuck - Here's a statement put out directly by the FDIC concerning WAMU
http://www.fdic.gov/bank/individual/failed/wamu.html

At a quick glance go down to section VI Loan Customers. You may also want to take a look at the purchase & assumption agreement VIII. Looks like you can download a copy to your desktop.
http://www.fdic.gov/about/freedom/Wa...al_P_and_A.pdf

[norcalstuck]

Freedom won, thanks for the links, will read today. And I have been to my county recorders office, and our original 2003 mortgage through WAMU is the only document, other than the Chase HELOC which they gave us within weeks of buying the house. In sept 2008, as our 5 year IO ARM was about to roll, WAMU offered us an extension, another 5 year IO, but for higher interest. We took it for fear we could get a refi, oh, and they offered it to us with no requalifocation, no new appraisal. Nothing has been recorded from that " modification" of our original loan. Our beneficiary is still WAMU f.a. With trustee as Calif Reconveyance, which was owned by WAMU I think

Hence, my interest about the purchase and assumption agreement, and finalization of the Chase deal. We are not interested in pursuing anything legally, but we are intrigued by how Chase will foreclose with nothing recorded in their name other than the HELOC. Interesting times we are in. Thanks again

[freedomwon]

norcalstuck - What I anticipate will happen is when they are about ready to foreclose, you will see an assignment deed of trust & a substitution of trustee recorded. If Chase is doing things in the proper order, this should occur BEFORE a NOD is filed.

Some banks (such as BofA) have done this half backwards. They filed my NOD before filing the assignment deed of trust & substitution of trustee. In essence that makes the NOD invalid.

[SONORACADREAM]

I to had a WAMU HELOC and they recently (Chase) are calling themselves WAMU? From the Grave it has risen like a zombie. WAMU was the bank that ripped me off and sent me for a Loan Modification in Costa Rica? I was given paperwork and it was more than I was presently paying. No I am sorry. What happens to the Titles on properties that Chase wants to forclose on but the Title Company no longer exists? Fisrt American Title?. Show me the note Chase? do they have one. I saw this WAMU section and it applies to our property. Same trustee also for sale? How can I postpone the sale further? It cant hurt to ask? I am in pain anyway.

[freedomwon]

SONORACADREAM - I'm going to venture off topic for a moment because this is important & relevant to your case. I've read most of your posts & am familiar with your story. I'm extremely concerned for:

1. Your personal recovery (you're fighting for your life battling cancer, which I know takes lots of energy).
2. The health of your wife
3. The health of your 2 children

Does it make sense for your family to continue living in the home while being exposed to toxic chemicals?
Do you have any money so you could move & rent somewhere?
What ever you decide, I will respect your decision. I would certainly help you with ideas to get your sale date postponed if that's what you truly want.

I can also recommend you speak to the liason at the hospital where you had your surgery & see what financial resources are available to help you with medical and or relocation/moving expenses.

[SONORACADREAM]

I have been out of work so long now I have enough money to feed my family and keep the lights on. Yes I understand what you mean with our health and everything, I am told that I would be fighting a uphill battle in the snow over prooving psyical problems connected with a meth lab, my wife is worried over the Trustee Sale that will come eventually and my oldest daughter with the eating disorder is off to colldege doing well, my youngest is getting better in the academic area with a Tudor I Barter construction tasks with. My Dr feels this conition as well its hard to proove . I have been here and owned this property since 2004, We all drink bottled now. I dont know if there is ways to push the banks sale off till later or not, I am thinking for my healing time, I have some work when I am able(contractor in CA work), my abdominal wall was cut 8" and lifting is my problem. I just need time to heal and back to work to pay rent that is all. Thanks for your concerns and offer for advice. I emailed Jamie Chase again, who knows if it will help I have a long history of problems with thier bank and WAMU. I went from a 760 credit score to ---- overnight I saw it coming. I allways payed my bills on time now hope seems so far away. One more postponed sale would be nice if you had Ideas that would help, when you have been in a place for so long it is hard to leave with no where to go. Thanks for your concern, I appreciate you.

[freedomwon]

SONORACADREAM - There's some things you can do to challenge the trustee. What you'll need to do is start getting your ducks lined up. First order of business is to get copies of all documents that have been filed at the county's recorders office since the origination of your loan. You will be looking for documents such as:

Deed of Trust
Notice of Default
Assignment of Deed of trust
Substitution of Trustee

Once you have copies of all these, you will look at signatures, execution dates, notary dates etc. You also want to begin familiarizing yourself with what local publication in your county the trustee is using to advertise the upcoming trustee sales. Some of the trustees are not publishing the sale as they should be. This is one of the legal requirements the trustee must follow prior to conducting a Trustee Sale. Notice of Sale must be published 3 times in the paper prior to sale.

You brought up some very valid points in your earlier post. I've had success getting my trustee sale postponed since last June. You can read some of the letters here: My recent letter to BofA (Part 2)

[Annie Mac]

FreedomWon, are you saying the Notice of Default needs to be recorded at the county clerk's office before they can proceed? In 2008, there was a Notice of Default recorded by Wamu, but it was rescinded when I paid the arrears. (no change then in the ARM terms after doing so) There is no new Notice of Default recorded. I have been in LimboLand ever since, with loan mods denied like clockwork. No modification offer but also no Notice of Default.

[SONORACADREAM]

Thank You, You are sharp. I am worried I dont have enough time? My sale is et for the 6th of Dec and It looks like you know some Law in you letters. I feel the fact the Title company is no longer Insuring the Property tha bank cant take it? First CA Bank is Dead.
Did you send the letters snail mail and signed for? I know we both have the same AG and maybe another address, I have a trustee that was used by WAMU before. I also printed off all my emails with WAMU before they went under, I also have saved all my emails to Chase Executive dept.
What this really comes down to is do they have Title and the Rights to Forclose on a Property they really may not have any documents to from the title company even WAMU documents ? I will study you posts and get as much info as I can before Court Day. Thank you so much. I believe in your Freedom wins attitude.

[freedomwon]

FreedomWon, are you saying the Notice of Default needs to be recorded at the county clerk's office before they can proceed?

I know that is the case in the state of Ca. however; looking back at one of your previous posts, I discovered you are in Oregon. You will need to study the foreclosure laws in Oregon to see if that's the case in your state.

In Ca., Once a notice of default is recorded it is valid for one year from filing date. If a trustee sale has not occurred during that time, a new notice of default must be filed & the process begins all over again.

[freedomwon]

SONORACADREAM - Unfortunately I think they will pull it off because of the details in that purchase & assumption agreement. (See post #5). I'm not saying I think it's right or that I agree with it. If you have the energy, definitely fight. At the very least, you can keep a roof over your head.

If I was in your shoes, my thought is your best line of defense is to challenge the trustee by insisting it is "unsecured" debt. If they do not have the "wet signature" promissory note & the "wet signature" deed of trust, the trustee has no standing to foreclose. Problem is, here in Ca., since the courts are not involved in the process, the sale just gets railroaded through at the court house steps.

[SONORACADREAM]

I am really at the end of my rope, who needs the stress added to the psyical problems, I guess you must have thought there was somthing different a few posts back we live in the same state, with the same laws. I will start packing, my home will be vacant I guarantee for a while after disclosures are made to environmental health, History of this property is on my side it has it. I am done and I fought a long time. Fighting the trustee on the courthouse steps is not my idea of a good holiday. What do you think? 2 to three months then before I am told to walk? Toulumne County has one of the highest rate of vacanct homes .People walk because of this stuff, who wants a few bucks, make the banks work for the title.

[SONORACADREAM]

I am going to make another call to the executive branch and see if they will make a change.I seem to get results this way just by talking to a person with the ability to freeze a sale. One more time till I heal internally

[freedomwon]

SONORACADREAM - I'm going to think good thoughts for you! Let's hope you get someone on the other end of the phone that will help. If not, call back again & talk to someone different. DON'T GIVE UP!

[freedomwon]

SONORACADREAM - One other idea that may help to get that sale date postponed...........See if you can find out what publication the trustee uses to publish the sales in your county. Call them or have a friend call & ask.

California Civil Code §2924f (b)(1) states, "before any sale of property
can be made under the power of sale contained in any deed of trust or
mortgage…notice of the sale thereof shall be given by posting a written
notice…describing the property to be sold, at least 20 days before the date of
sale…and publishing a copy once a week for three consecutive calendar weeks,
the first publication to be at least 20 days before the date of sale…The notice of
sale shall contain…the name of the original trustor".

If you discover the sale of your property has not been published properly, by law the trustee may not proceed with the sale.

[7kistoomuch]

I know that is the case in the state of Ca. however; looking back at one of your previous posts, I discovered you are in Oregon. You will need to study the foreclosure laws in Oregon to see if that's the case in your state.

In Ca., Once a notice of default is recorded it is valid for one year from filing date. If a trustee sale has not occurred during that time, a new notice of default must be filed & the process begins all over again.

Freedomwon - Can you identify the section of CA Civil Code that states an NOD must be refiled after one year? I have never heard of this requirement before, nor could I find it when I searched. Thank you.

[freedomwon]

Freedomwon - Can you identify the section of CA Civil Code that states an NOD must be refiled after one year? I have never heard of this requirement before, nor could I find it when I searched. Thank you.

Hi 7kistoomuch - I recall seeing it in the Ca. State Statutes. Unfortunately, either I didn't save it or can't find it in my notes. Should I come across it again, I'll be sure to post it.

[Annie Mac]

Norcalstuck,
I just reread your postings on this thread. On the other thread, the QWR address to Chase, I had stated how similar our situations were. Well, we both were in a major "SHIFT PATTERN" during the weeks of August-September 2008 when the changeover occurred between Wamu and Chase. You had modified, but that was never recorded. I had just paid the chunk to keep foreclosure at bay, but then nothing occurred to modify my ARM, and I got shifted from a modification which was "right around the corner" into the deep dark abyss of Chase. Now, we are both sending in application after application for a loan mod...not getting anywhere, not going frontwards or backwards. We have both been told by Chase that they own our loans, but they are not treating us with a red carpet. The fact that we are both experiencing identical treatment, or non-treatment, and that we were in the middle of a major shift in our loans in 2008 with Wamu seems very interesting. I think it is important that we continue to compare developments.

[norcalstuck]

Sounds like a good idea Annie Mac. We are curious as to why we have not received Chase offer to pay us to do a short sale. According to all the criteria I can find as to what qualifies one to receive this Chase offer, our loan tpe Nd amount should fit. But who knows? Iam watching the county recorder office like a hawk for the official NOD. Have a good holiday. 2012 will surely be better

[Annie Mac]

Norcalstuck,
Yes, it does sound as if most of us Wamu/Chase folks have received that offer letter within the last nine months. Also, what makes you believe that California Reconveyance Co is owned by Wamu? They were posted as the trustee at one point on my loan, and there was an interesting signing to Chase (by the robosigner) and California Reconveyance Co. or so it seemed. California Reconveyance seemed to be the trustee/foreclosure agency of choice by Wamu, but I haven't seen anything which indicates they are owned by Wamu. Please fill me in if you know more. Do you have a current HAMP application going on? I have submitted again, but they have not assigned a RM to me and it's been over a month...also no written statement of denial on the last application. Now they want "more paperwork," and so the fun begins again. Yes, have a good holiday weekend.

[dry hopping mad]

Annie Mac, my wife and I have a similar situation. We closed on a WAMU 1st and 2nd home loan in July, 2006. After repeated attempts to modify over the past two years, we hear very little from Chase. We are in our 17th month of default and the loan is in foreclosure status. We know Chase has contacted a local attorney.

Since you aren't going forward or backwards, what is your next action? We are thinking short sale, but don't want to hurry ourselves out of a house we enjoy so much.

[Annie Mac]

Norcalstuck, I hope you are still hanging in there and not giving up yet. My question about California Reconveyance was answered when I saw the duplication of Chase employees/executives who also are in positions at California Reconveyance, so the two appear to be one and the same.
Dry Hopping Mad, for so long I kept having this intuitive feeling that something was haywire with my loan...it was so obvious the loan mod denials were a sham and silly me worked so hard to get that happening. Up to the point of the Rest Report being part of the last application package. They cannot modify us, they cannot foreclose on us. Their best hope is to send us a letter offering a short sale and hoping it arrives to a homeowner who is weary that day. Those of us who were Wamu/Chase, are in the desert. Wamu didn't assign papers, the sale to Chase has not completed, so Chase is solely our debt collector. The best course of action seems to be visiting the compost pile of chain of title, researching as much as one can, and then sitting tight. If you are in that group of Wamu/Chase it is likely your chain of title is not solid. Why would Chase be contacting a local attorney? How would you have found this out without a NOD?

[dry hopping mad]

Annie Mac, very good stuff. We had the same suspicions about the loans. I am heading down to the courthouse to check on the
chain of title. WAMU was listed as Beneficiary on our original loan docs. As for the local attorney, we have not been contacted by them, nor have we received any letter or posting on our house.

How do we discover more about any potential NOD?

[dry hopping mad]

County Register said this morning that WAMU was on the Deed of Trust and listed as Beneficiary. Also, no NOD has been filed as of today.

[Annie Mac]

Dry Hopping Mad,

What state are you in? As you can tell from reading the posts here, things vary state to state. It is common that the NOD must be filed with the county before actual foreclosure can begin. I have been in "active foreclosure" for as long as I can remember. But no NOD. Not sure how, but Chase employees for a year or more have been saying,"you are in active foreclosure."

There are no other assignments, substitutions, etc, with your county clerk? Just the original deed of trust being filed? Did you get a copy of that original filing so you could view any numbers, trustee groups, etc.? There are several theories-truths-wonderings floating around; one is that Wamu shipped all their paperwork to Mexico, and they haven't been located since, another is that Chase, though they use the language of being the successor to Wamu,are really only a third party debt collector, which changes what they can do and must comply with Fair Debt Collection practices, so they are not our lender. Another, more recent theory, is the FDIC is holding our notes. The last theory could explain a lot of why we are on hold going nowhere. Doesn't make sense, would be illegal, but none of this makes sense or is legal, so that is actually possibly quite likely.
The key is to find your Pooling and Servicing Agreement which is the subject of other postings, and is very challenging to do. This is where a loan or securitization audit is a choice some make when they have taken it as far as they can go themselves.
If Chase is indeed a debt collector for us, and cannot modify our loans, their best hope is for compliance from us, to willingly turn the house over to them, do a short sale, etc. I think it is important to keep comparing the situations of the Wamu/Chase group. There is definitely a pattern here in what has happened to us.

[dry hopping mad]

Annie Mac -- We live in Nebraska. Yes, we have been in active foreclosure status with Chase for over a year. No other 'anythings' filed at the courthouse. The warranty deed has the builder's name on it (we bought the lot and built the house thru him). No change of trustee filed either. They gave me a copy of the warranty deed and it matches the copy I have from the 2006 loan closing. I was given a print out of the deed of trust and it has the original trustee's name on it and WAMU as beneficiary.

Moe Bedard (another member on loansafe that has good advice) just wrote a reply and confirmed that the sale of WAMU to Chase is complete. But he did not elaborate.

" Hello, The sale is complete. My thoughts are they will never change each deed of trust because it is simply impossible. They just now own each WAMU deed which they can prove in court when needed." --Moe

My take is that Chase could prove they own my deed but because they are just so big and incompetent that quite a number of loans in default are, so far, going unattended. So far we have flown under the radar. But I am lining up alternative housing, saving $$ for a move and so on. One rumor that I would like to hear more about is that Chase is offering $$ to get WAMU customers to move out or in conjunction with a SS.

I so agree that our WAMU/Chase family needs to keep talking and comparing notes. Loansafe and folks like you have been a real help and even encouragement to me. Thank you. In fact, I went to the courthouse after reading one of your threads. Knew what to ask for too. Thank you, Thank you.

[Annie Mac]

Dry Hopping Mad,

It seems to be that most of us Wamu/Chase folk received Short Sale offer letters over a period of time during 2011, beginning in the Spring, and dribbling in without any particular pattern of value of the house, time of default, etc. The offers ranged from 10,000 to 35,000 for the short sale. Some people thought this was great. I read on one site that 40,000 letters were sent to Wamu loan holders. Interesting that my letter was sent shortly after my loan number got changed by Chase "to get the Wamu loans in the same data base as the Chase loans." When the switchover from Wamu to Chase happened, it seems that some stitches were dropped. One statement said,"It is cheaper for the bank to pay the homeowners off than deal with a class action." Again, you have to check it out yourself..do your own research.

There are quite a few Wamu and Chase specific websites that record these in detail. I would suggest you search those out; unfortunately, one of them, www.wamuloanfraud.com , or the Wamu Homeowner's Support Group doesn't seem to be up lately.
There has been a lot going on legally lately, the lawsuit against Wamu executives in December, and on another site, a new lawsuit against Chase for forging documents to foreclose on people:
Class Action — Chase Accused of Brazen Bankruptcy Fraud « Livinglies's Weblog It all seems to be unravelling pretty quickly. A lot to keep up with nationally, besides one's own paperwork trail.


I don't know what to say about the closure of the Chase sale. Moe Bedard would have pretty current information...Could you comment on that Moe? Your source of information?

[Annie Mac]

I just discovered what happened to the wamu homeowner's site... it was evidently hijacked by a Chase executive. It is a reminder that the information we can share and have access to is precious, and of course, also being read by Chase. Anyway, a new site is up to replace the old. It is extensive, exhaustive, and has so many details of the history of the Wamu period, court cases, links for researching your loan...it is a lot to digest:

Home Page

[freedomwon]

Annie Mac - I will take that a step further & add if anyone on loansafe sees information helpful to their case, be sure to dowloand to a file on your desktop. Do not rely on links, websites or attachments. What's here today could be gone tomorrow! I've seen it happen. Important information can disappear.

[Annie Mac]

Two sources of checking out the status of Chase are the lawsuits: the December FDIC lawsuit against Washington Mutual executives which was for 900 billion, settled for 64 billion, and will result in each exec probably giving up around 400,000 personally of retirement, etc.
Another is the Dexia lawsuit against Chase for 1.7 billion for Egregious Fraud. It is a well written summary which covers everything we have experienced as Wamu/Chase homeowners, but in legal language. It casts an interesting light on just what Chase's role really is:
"as a result of the Wamu Bank acquisition, JP Morgan Chase Bank is a mere continuation of WaMu Bank." Since they are holding Chase responsible for the securities obligations of Wamu, it will be intersting to see if Chase tries to wiggle out of this. It will say a lot to us about their rights and responsibilities; you can't have it both ways.
At Dexia v. Bear Stearns | “Egregious Fraud” Dexia Sues JPMorgan Over $1.7 Billion in Mortgage Securities | Foreclosure Fraud - Fighting Foreclosure Fraud by Sharing the Knowledge you can read all 122 pages of the lawsuit. It is not for the faint of heart; it was hard to read the details of the fraud even though I knew it so well from a different perspective. Not light bedtime reading in other words.

[KevinWAMUCHASEMOD]

In same situation, had WAMU neg-am arm, was transferred to Chase (ha-ha). Keep in mind 1 important thing, everyone is focusing on the legality of everything, understood because we all try to figure out how to fix our own situation. However, try to look at it from Chase's side to figure out what their motivation is. Has anyone figured out what their cost basis is ? I have spoke to many Chase "reps" , but recently one revealed to me that the only loans being offered the SS move on $$ are the ones from WAMU. HMMMM, wonder why, could it be that Chase paid 1.88 Bln dollars for a 188 bln dollar portfolio, putting them in at worst, 2% of loan value. So if they walk softly, collect what they can from the last couple of years or so on us trying to keep up, even in modified situations they at least cover costs. Further, when they foreclose, especially from cooperative homeowners, they can offer a % of what they collect, because they only paid 2% of your loan value. Anyone with 1 % FED money can make $$ in that environment.

[Martinique]

Interesting thread.
I also had a loan with Wamu which was turned over to Chase. I just completed a short sale (in California) with no problem - eight weeks from submitting short sale offer to Chase to close of escrow. Also received the 3K for HAFA. I never was offered any financial incentive to do a short sale. I am putting all this behind me but I can't help wonder why Chase was so cooperative :-)

[Annie Mac]

A Ray of Light ! Digging and digging, looking at the original loan papers carefully, reviewing the recorded documents, I have received a NOD and date of non-judicial auction after four years of nothing....repeated loan mod applications (I lost count, but at least 10 to12, with repeated faxes for all of it over and over....no trial offer. You have read my posts stating I get the feeling something is weird with my loan...The language, the wording is critical. Wamu, Washington Mutual Bank, Washington Mutual Bank, FA, we throw these out but they are not the same. My loan was with Washington Mutual Bank, FA in 2007, but WMBFA ceased to exist after April of 2005. My original DOT was to a non-existent lender. I know Norcalstuck, you said your beneficiary was also WMBFA. Not sure about you, DryHoppingMad. Now, Chase is trying to foreclose in the name of WMBFA, the non-existent beneficiary, who was a non-existent legal entity at the time the original loan was made. Evidently, they continued writing loans under the old name to streamline securitization. Check the name in its entirety on your paperwork. So, for some of us, the FDIC agreement of transfer/sale to Chase is inconsequential; our loans were already a joke long before that. Open for any ideas, case studies, strategies. The truth is getting stranger than anything one could possibly make up.