Fed-Ex came with Permanent Modification, No Joke!

[pbharris4]

Originally Posted by snapple candy

Gordilox,
Congrats, you have worked hard at this. I assume they applied the "waterfall" correctly in your case? How underwater are you? When is your first payment due in relation to your last trial payment?

I did get one of those "Mod at risk" fed ex's twice and called repeatedly and they said they had everything. I then emailed original Chase Fan. Mae negotiator. This is the response I got recently:

"File is ready for final underwrite and it's pending review."

Im not sure what to think about where I am in this process. Is this where the rubber meets the road and they decide to accept or deny me? I am making my 5th trial payment today reluctantly. I like your demand letter requesting final modification.

Thanks for all your postings. they have been real helpful!

Hi Snapple!

You and I are almost at the exact same place. I just made our 4th trial payment. We were just called today by someone named Ann Marlow and were told it's about to go to underwriting and we will have a decision in a couple of weeks.

With the HELOC when they told us that the modification came within a few weeks. Of course, we declined it it with our reasoning being..not signing off on the HELOC until the FIRST is taken care of.

I am hoping to know something soon either way.

[caldwellb02]

You two are my role models. I haven't even gotten the trial yet!!!

[pbharris4]

Not getting my hopes up. I won't be sure of anything until I have perm. mod. paperwork in my hands. Don't know if we will be denied or not. I sure hope not. If we are denied. That's the end of the road for this house unfortunately. But I hope to hang out here at least until my daughter graduates.

[snapple candy]

Hi Pb and caldwell,
I havent heard from my HELOC yet and that also held by Chase. I wont agree to anything till the 1st makes me aware of final terms.
Honestly, I have such mixed feeling about the whole thing and have fought for so many months......going on 1.5 years. I have done the math and it will be 10 years before I ever break even, I just dont know if it is really worth holding on to in the long run.

Caldwell, I cant believe you dont even have a trial yet. I suppose if I do get a perm mod offer, it will be bittersweet. Been thru so much, I really dont want to care anymore. What is it about be careful what you ask for....

[gordilox86]

Originally Posted by ChaseVictim

Gordilox86, Congrats!

What was your hardship? Were you behind on your payments? If so, by how many months? ALso, what steps were taken to contact the Exec team?

1 - My hardship was a paycut at work of $1,000 per month.

2 - I was not behind on my payments. I remained current throughout process. Credit has been reflected as current throughout process.

3 - To obtain my contact at Exec team I wroter letters to the following parties citing the HAMP guidelines had not been followed by Freddie Mac (Investor) and Chase Bank (Servicer):

Freddie Mac, Attn: Vice President, Making Home Affordable – Compliance, 8100 Jones Branch Drive, McLean VA 22102

Freddie Mac, Legal Division – HQ – 1 PHO1, 8200 Jones Branch Drive, McLean VA, 22102-3110

Chase Home Finance LLC, General Counsel, 194 Wood Avenue South, Floor 2, Iselin, NJ 08830-2710

Chase Home Finance, LLC, Executive Resolution Group, 3415 Vision Drive, Columbus, OH 43219-6009

[gordilox86]

Originally Posted by snapple candy

Gordilox,
Congrats, you have worked hard at this. I assume they applied the "waterfall" correctly in your case? How underwater are you? When is your first payment due in relation to your last trial payment?

I did get one of those "Mod at risk" fed ex's twice and called repeatedly and they said they had everything. I then emailed original Chase Fan. Mae negotiator. This is the response I got recently:

"File is ready for final underwrite and it's pending review."

Im not sure what to think about where I am in this process. Is this where the rubber meets the road and they decide to accept or deny me? I am making my 5th trial payment today reluctantly. I like your demand letter requesting final modification.

Thanks for all your postings. they have been real helpful!

SnappleCandy,

1 - My Servicer, (Chase) did apply the "waterfall" approach correctly and came very close to the Target Payment, just as described in the guidelines and Freddie Mac video.

2) I am only underwater by approx. $55k - 65k.

3) I made 5 Trial Period Payments starting June 1, 2009. The permanent modification becomes effective November 1, 2009 with the first modified payment due December 1, 2009, as follows:

June 1, 2009 - Trial Pmt#1
July 1, 2009 - Trial Pmt #2
August 1, 2009 - Trial Pmt#3
September 1, 2009 - Addn'l Trial Pmt #4
October 1, 2009 - Addn'l Trial Pmt #5
November 1, 2009 - Permanent Loan Modification becomes effective on this date - An Addn'l Trial Pmt#6 is optional per HAMP Coverletter.
December 1, 2009 - First permanent modificaiton payment due.

I could only get a straight answer out of the Executive Resolution Analyst who would barely respond to me. I believe the Modification At-Risk packet is another way for Chase to document that the reason for the delay was borrower imposed. Chase and Freddie are fighting for more time. They told me my file was in underwriting from August 31st thru October 20th.... The receipt of the Permanent Modification Agreement came as a complete surprise to me as neither an Analyst nor the Exec Resolution Analyst informed me the package was actually being sent.

To get things moving you must document two things: 1) Timely Trial Payments, 2) All paperwork has been provided. Write up a letter demanding permanent modification. Indicate dates timely Trial Payment was made and date all paperwork was provided.

[litehouse01]

But for those of us who are behind I wonder if chase views things differently and will just stamp us all with blanket denials..I wonder is bankruptcy is the only way to save my home? my head is just spinning trying to decide what to do

[c150000]

GORDILOX86

you said you remained current during thr hamp process?
you mean you were current and stayed current with trial payments?
or did you make trial payments in amount of your regular mortgage payment?

and aslo do you know if we are allowed to pay down some of the payments that
are adding up on the plan?
the hamp paper work states if you pay more than your trial payment you may be denied?
would that mean if your trial payment is 1000.00 dont pay 1500.00 every month////
or would that mean you can pay anything BUT the trial payment and nothing else on
what you owe
i dont have much... but i could maybe pay one extra month or so iam not in that 3 or more month status if iam denied....
or should i wait?

[gordilox86]

Originally Posted by litehouse01

But for those of us who are behind I wonder if chase views things differently and will just stamp us all with blanket denials..I wonder is bankruptcy is the only way to save my home? my head is just spinning trying to decide what to do

Litehouse,

It will be much easier for someone who is behind to get into the Trial Period Plan and Permanent Modification as opposed to a current borrower.

[gordilox86]

Originally Posted by c150000

GORDILOX86

you said you remained current during thr hamp process?
you mean you were current and stayed current with trial payments?
or did you make trial payments in amount of your regular mortgage payment?

and aslo do you know if we are allowed to pay down some of the payments that
are adding up on the plan?
the hamp paper work states if you pay more than your trial payment you may be denied?
would that mean if your trial payment is 1000.00 dont pay 1500.00 every month////
or would that mean you can pay anything BUT the trial payment and nothing else on
what you owe
i dont have much... but i could maybe pay one extra month or so iam not in that 3 or more month status if iam denied....
or should i wait?

I remained current on my original mortgage payment until I was presented with the Home Affordable Trial Period Plan (signed by Chase), effective June 1, 2009.

On June 1, 2009 I began making Trial Payments which were approx. $1,100 less than my original mortgage payment. I made a total of 5 of these reduced Trial Payments before permanent modification. I made sure to make each of these 5 Trial Payments 5-6 days in advance of month-end. I retained Fed-Ex signature receipt confirmations for each payment and I then confirmed each payment had been applied towards the Trial Period Plan.

If you are under the Home Affordable Trial Period Plan (Freddie/Fannie form 3156), make the reduced Trial Payment amount, no more, no less.

If you have extra money saved up during Trial Period, pay off your credit card, auto loans and any other debts you may have. Keep whatever money is left over (if any) for potential attorney fees for a lawyer in case you are denied permanent modification. Give the addresses above and all correspondence under my user name to your attorney.

[smit5454]

Gordi,

Man your situation is a perfect mirror of mine. I was current also before the trial mod and contacted Chase letting them know that I had exhausted all options and from that point forward would not be current. I hope I get approved soon since our time frames are very similar.

Have a good day.

[c150000]

Thank you..............again

[smit5454]

Gordi,

The "Your modification letter is at risk letter says, "Thank you for participating in the "Chase Home Loan Modification" program. All along I have been told my plan is the O'Bama plan, but I don;t see anything in here indicating this. The only mention of Obama is a comment about being carefull about debt collection agencies "As Stated in The Questionas and Anaswers for Borrowers about the Homeowner Affordability and Stability Plan".

Were your at risk letters the same?

[litehouse01]

gordi..........if you don't mind my asking did you have much in the way of back end debt? if so was it a factor?

[gordilox86]

Originally Posted by smit5454

Gordi,

The "Your modification letter is at risk letter says, "Thank you for participating in the "Chase Home Loan Modification" program. All along I have been told my plan is the O'Bama plan, but I don;t see anything in here indicating this. The only mention of Obama is a comment about being carefull about debt collection agencies "As Stated in The Questionas and Anaswers for Borrowers about the Homeowner Affordability and Stability Plan".

Were your at risk letters the same?

I did not receive an "At Risk" letter. I sent my updated Financial Information after making my second Trial Payment. Chase never requested that I send this Financial Information, but I sent it because I thought Chase would use it as a reason to delay Permanent Modification, which they did anyway.

Did you ever receive the "Home Affordable Trial Period Plan (Freddie/Fannie Form 3156)"? If you did not receive this form then you are not in the Obama Gov't HAMP program. Becuase these matters involve real estate, it doesn't matter what Chase tells you. Everything must be in writing!

[gordilox86]

Originally Posted by litehouse01

gordi..........if you don't mind my asking did you have much in the way of back end debt? if so was it a factor?

Litehouse,

I have to appologize... I'm not sure what "back-end debt" is?

I did have a few thousand in credit card debt. No auto loans or other debts. Just the 1st mortgage of approx. $395k.

The borrower debt ratios are a factor in a new loan, but I don't think they carry wait in the Gov't HAMP calculation.

My understanding is the Servicer must use a "Waterfall Approach" to acheive the "Target Payment" (Target Payment cannot exceed 31% of Monthly Gross Income)? This approach requires Servicers to first reduce interest rates to 2%, then increase term of loan and finally forbear (not forgive) principal. Forbear means to tack on principal to back-end of loan which must eventually be repaid as a balloon payment at end of loan. Interest does not accrue on pincipal forbore.

If after applying the above Waterfall Approach the NPV (Net Present Value) of stream of payments under modified loan is less than Cost of Foreclosure (Cost of Foreclosure = Market Price per BPO (Broker Price Opinion) less Cost of Foreclosure ($40 - $60k)), then Servicer may deny the modification and seek other foreclosure prevention alternatives.

If a borrower is denied a HAMP modification my understanding is the Investor (if Fannae Mae and Freddie Mac), must re-check Servicer calculations to make absolutely certain the Borrower does not qualify.

[shade]

Gordi Ill ask - what was the gross monthly income and monthly debt (credit debt)
Of course if you dont mind sharing

I assume they didnt try to include things like food and your debt.

[exhausted by chase]

Thanks to Chase, I think I have an ulcer.

I applied for the "Making Home Affordable Plan", back in April. My packet sat for nearly a month and half before "being assigned" to anyone. I was current on my payments. I thought it was odd that that when I called and kept checking back, one guy told me to skip my June payment "because if I didn't I wouldn't be eligible". That scared me. I've never missed a payment. I had mentioned to them, in April/May that I was dangerously close of not being able to afford my payments. August came, couldn't make my payment, September either. Bottom line - after many calls I was finally approved for the 3-month trial period.

But, what I learned in the process, will hopefully help you.

~When I first started, I was "current" with my payments, so I was assigned to one department. Then, I found out, that they had to open another department, for people who were "current", because they didn't have one....another delay.

~In the mean time of their delays and me missing two payments (August/September), my file or account was transferred to the "Imminant Default" department. During this time, I was set up on the 3-month trial period. My payments are October, November and December.

~In the mean time again, they now consider me THREE months behind, because it basically takes 1 1/2 of my "modified" payments to make one of my regular payments (which they apply to my most deliquent payment - August) So now I'm behind for my full payments for September, October and November - because I didn't technically make "full" payments for October and November and those payments were applied to my August deliquent payment. Well when you're THREE months behind, your file or account gets sent to the "Loss Mitigation" department....a completely new department.

During my calls to Chase, while I was in between the "Imminant Default" department and the "Loss Mitigation" Department, in earl/ mid October (after I had made my first modified payment) - That I most likely wouldn't have an answer on my permanent modification, until January some time, because that particular underwriter was behind, so I'd most likely be making a 4th modified payment...Ok fine with me. Then, after I make my second (November payment), I receive a letter in the mail, date the end of October - I've been DENIED for a permanent modification, "because your hardship is not of a permanent nature". I FREAKED out. Spent the night making calls to who ever I could to get an answer. Well apparently and here is the clencher - This letter came from the IMMINANT DEFAULT department. I was told too - "well we run you for a variety of "other" loan modifications, within our department" and you didn't qualify for any of those.

SO...I get transferred to the Loss Mitigation department. I'm told - "No, you're still in the trial period, keep making your modified payments. We're a totally different department, with different loan modification programs". So, I guess the bottom line is - Chase keeps telling me that I'm DENIED for any of their loan modifications and sending me letters and telling me I'm DENIED, when I call (which I didn't apply for), but I'm still in the Obama Making Home Affordable Plan.

Today I called Chase (Loss Mit Dept) and just wanted to know, if they could go ahead and approve me for some "other" program, so I could be done with this and have a permanent answer. They said NO, I could only apply for one program at a time. I asked, well what if I'm denied in the end? Then we'll offer you a -can't remember what he called it exactly - but we'll send you a bill for what you owe and you can pay that....UM HELLO...if I could have to begin with, I would have.

He tells me also, that Freddie Mac is my investor and Chase is just my servicer. Is this a good thing? Does anyone happen to know how many loan modifications Freddie Mac approves? I just keep hearing and reading horror stories about Chase. I've got a job....I can pay, but I need a reasonable monthly payment. Shoot, even if they lowered it $300.00 I could do it.

Has anyone else had experience with the "missed payments" and "difference between your actual monthly payment and your modfied" monthly payment? Example - My monthly was $1837, my modified is $1206. What will they do with the $631 difference? The paper work says something about adding it on to the end of my loan, but it doesn't sound like that is really what happens?

So for those of you, who keep getting DENIED, maybe you need to find out if these "so called denials" are from the bank that services your loan who are "running you through other programs" that you knew nothing about, or if it is actually the OBAMA plan.

On another note - A girlfriend of mine applied for a loan modification - she got two denial letters and then a month later, she got a FED EX package, setting up her 3 month trial period....so it's very confusing.

Good Luck everyone and lets remind these bank folks, that they "need to pay it forward". We, as tax payers, bailed them out, now we're asking for a little recipocation.

[Sunbeam]

Originally Posted by exhausted by chase

Thanks to Chase, I think I have an ulcer.

I applied for the "Making Home Affordable Plan", back in April. My packet sat for nearly a month and half before "being assigned" to anyone. I was current on my payments. I thought it was odd that that when I called and kept checking back, one guy told me to skip my June payment "because if I didn't I wouldn't be eligible". That scared me. I've never missed a payment. I had mentioned to them, in April/May that I was dangerously close of not being able to afford my payments. August came, couldn't make my payment, September either. Bottom line - after many calls I was finally approved for the 3-month trial period.

But, what I learned in the process, will hopefully help you.

~When I first started, I was "current" with my payments, so I was assigned to one department. Then, I found out, that they had to open another department, for people who were "current", because they didn't have one....another delay.

~In the mean time of their delays and me missing two payments (August/September), my file or account was transferred to the "Imminant Default" department. During this time, I was set up on the 3-month trial period. My payments are October, November and December.

~In the mean time again, they now consider me THREE months behind, because it basically takes 1 1/2 of my "modified" payments to make one of my regular payments (which they apply to my most deliquent payment - August) So now I'm behind for my full payments for September, October and November - because I didn't technically make "full" payments for October and November and those payments were applied to my August deliquent payment. Well when you're THREE months behind, your file or account gets sent to the "Loss Mitigation" department....a completely new department.

During my calls to Chase, while I was in between the "Imminant Default" department and the "Loss Mitigation" Department, in earl/ mid October (after I had made my first modified payment) - That I most likely wouldn't have an answer on my permanent modification, until January some time, because that particular underwriter was behind, so I'd most likely be making a 4th modified payment...Ok fine with me. Then, after I make my second (November payment), I receive a letter in the mail, date the end of October - I've been DENIED for a permanent modification, "because your hardship is not of a permanent nature". I FREAKED out. Spent the night making calls to who ever I could to get an answer. Well apparently and here is the clencher - This letter came from the IMMINANT DEFAULT department. I was told too - "well we run you for a variety of "other" loan modifications, within our department" and you didn't qualify for any of those.

SO...I get transferred to the Loss Mitigation department. I'm told - "No, you're still in the trial period, keep making your modified payments. We're a totally different department, with different loan modification programs". So, I guess the bottom line is - Chase keeps telling me that I'm DENIED for any of their loan modifications and sending me letters and telling me I'm DENIED, when I call (which I didn't apply for), but I'm still in the Obama Making Home Affordable Plan.

Today I called Chase (Loss Mit Dept) and just wanted to know, if they could go ahead and approve me for some "other" program, so I could be done with this and have a permanent answer. They said NO, I could only apply for one program at a time. I asked, well what if I'm denied in the end? Then we'll offer you a -can't remember what he called it exactly - but we'll send you a bill for what you owe and you can pay that....UM HELLO...if I could have to begin with, I would have.

He tells me also, that Freddie Mac is my investor and Chase is just my servicer. Is this a good thing? Does anyone happen to know how many loan modifications Freddie Mac approves? I just keep hearing and reading horror stories about Chase. I've got a job....I can pay, but I need a reasonable monthly payment. Shoot, even if they lowered it $300.00 I could do it.

Has anyone else had experience with the "missed payments" and "difference between your actual monthly payment and your modfied" monthly payment? Example - My monthly was $1837, my modified is $1206. What will they do with the $631 difference? The paper work says something about adding it on to the end of my loan, but it doesn't sound like that is really what happens?

So for those of you, who keep getting DENIED, maybe you need to find out if these "so called denials" are from the bank that services your loan who are "running you through other programs" that you knew nothing about, or if it is actually the OBAMA plan.

On another note - A girlfriend of mine applied for a loan modification - she got two denial letters and then a month later, she got a FED EX package, setting up her 3 month trial period....so it's very confusing.

Good Luck everyone and lets remind these bank folks, that they "need to pay it forward". We, as tax payers, bailed them out, now we're asking for a little recipocation.

This is a great post with good information. I had Ciit as servicer, Freddie as lender and it took me 9 mos to get a modification. I was not eligible for HAMP and in the end got a very good deal. I would suggest contacting Freddie Mac...I did this and the person who I emailed (in addition to my congressperson) got things jumpstarted for me around August. I had started the process last February and really got the same kind of treatment you have received up until I started my letter writing campaign.

I wrote directly to this person: philip_theis@freddiemac.com and told him about my problems and he CALLED me and told me he was going to escalate the situation. He did and four months (yes it took that long, but I always felt things were going to work out during this period and I was kept in the loop about what was going on) later I got a modification to 4.5% permanent, extended to 40 years, dropping our house payment by over $600.00.

Philip was not the person handling it, but he knew who to go to in order to get things done. After he got involved my case was assigned to a wonderful negotiator within CITI who always had my back. She made sure the expenses vs income was done according to the formula needed in order to get me the best deal possible. I would not hesitate to say after all I went through with her that I consider her to be a friend...

Hope this info helps. Keep fighting. Don't give up!

[Stuart C]

Thank you Exausted, that was very informative. I'm in pretty much in the same boat with the my payments before and after I started this process. My latest status is my update of my info wasn't quite complete and I had to correct some of it. I faxed the additional info and it was on their system by the next day. For Chase, that seems like a major improvement!

[c150000]

Gordilox86
i have been on the hamp trail for 3 months now and yesterday i recived
a acceleration notice { intent to forclose} notice
saying i have 32 days to cure default ect ect
also says info on mods and other plans ect ect
and a flyer explaining there is help ....
I called they said my mod in under review,, and computer sent out the letter automatic..
The letter says i owe aug sept and oct but did not include payment i sent in for nov 1st trial payment so iam realy 2 1/2 months with out november,,,,,,,,,

what should i do? Did you get one of these letters?
I thought they couldnt sent this out if your on the hamp trial payment
plan....
I have to make sure it goes no further and sugestions

[exhausted by chase]

SUNBEAM

So let me ask you this: Were you already behind in your payments, when you contacted Freddie Mac directly?

So, is your new payment 31% of your gross (as I see your interest rate is 4.95%)?

Is this a permanent modification, monthly payment now?

Shoot, I'd be fine, even if my payment wasn't 31%, of my gross, but currently it's roughly 50% of my gross and I have a second mortgage. I also have a roommate. I'm wondering if I should tell them about that (if they even ask, or want to know if I have any "additional" income). Does anyone know? I told Chase and I don't know if it will help my case or not, but when I bought the house, I was engaged, therefore I had another income to rely on, even though, his income had no part in me getting approved for the loan, I qualified on my own. We haven't been together for a while and I've assumed 100% of the house responsibilities. I work for a county, that is requiring us to take "furlough" days and Chase told me that they didn't consider that a "permanent" hardship. We're going to have to take them this coming year and probably the next few. I had my union write me a letter about it.

I just need this to all be over....I will email philip on Monday, thanks for the contact information. I'm just not the type to sit around and wait.

Thanks Sunbeam.

[gordilox86]

Originally Posted by c150000

Gordilox86
i have been on the hamp trail for 3 months now and yesterday i recived
a acceleration notice { intent to forclose} notice
saying i have 32 days to cure default ect ect
also says info on mods and other plans ect ect
and a flyer explaining there is help ....
I called they said my mod in under review,, and computer sent out the letter automatic..
The letter says i owe aug sept and oct but did not include payment i sent in for nov 1st trial payment so iam realy 2 1/2 months with out november,,,,,,,,,

what should i do? Did you get one of these letters?
I thought they couldnt sent this out if your on the hamp trial payment
plan....
I have to make sure it goes no further and sugestions

Two questions:

1) Have you received the "Home Affordable Trial Period Plan" (Freddie Mac/Fannie Mae form 3156)?
2) What state are you located?

[c150000]

iam in rhode island

form 3156-- i still dont know what that is ? if your talking about the signed agreement back from chase, no i dont have it they say new guidelines now they dont have to send it to me
if you talking about something else.. iam not sure what that is {3156}

iam in the home affordable trial plan ---yes
iam fannie mae----

[c150000]

gordilox86
yes i looked up what the 3156 form is and yes i have that ,,,,,,
my page lay out looks a little diffrent than the one i looked up maybe they changed it but the wording is all the same