At What Point are People Being Offered "Trial Plan"

[marmor653]

I'm wondering how far into this process all of ya'll are being offered these "Trail Payments"???????

Not once has anything been mentioned to me for this from Chase. We meet all the specifications: Upside down, Loss of Income, Pay reduction.

I was even rejected for a Payment Deferral, simply because I could not come up with the escrow payment by the allotted time they gave. Now their (Chase) showing that we have been "Put on Hold for anymore Payment Deferral Offers".

[SBBLUEWATER1]

We had to miss 3 payments before being approved for the MHA with the trial period plan.

[BudgetCutsinOC]

I missed 2 months...

[marmor653]

I'm at the 2 months missed pymts. And all I'm getting is the run around. Oh Yeah, and being told "It's pre-foreclosure time".

Would ya'll mind sharing the number or numbers your calling to speak with someone?

Maybe I'm not getting to the right dept. Go figure.

[BudgetCutsinOC]

marmor, It depends on your situation and of course who you talk too. When they called me I wasnt expecting a "phone interview." AFter about the 20th harrassing phone call and me telling them I had NO MONEY to give them they decided to make an arrangement. I believe they try to get people in a "forbearance" plan before they offer the BETTER 3 month trial plan.
The key is to withdraw your saving account and put it under your bed! Because if they see that you have up to 3 times yours monthly mortgage they will gladly tell you that you dont meet the requirements! Then guess what you have to drain your account!!
TELL THEM YOU HAVE NO MONEY TO GIVE THEM!

[rachel_p]

I can't believe this. We called for a single payment deferral a YEAR ago and they said no. Didn't even give us the option of keeping up with escrow to get it through.
Now we are 6 months behind because they keep telling us not to pay.
They are such a mess over there at chase. A literal mess. I don't know how they stay in business. The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing.

[marmor653]

Don't feel bad Rachel P, a year ago they told us the samething. Said they didn't have such a program to defer payments. It came to quite a shock to me when they offered it a month ago. The problem was, I wasn't prepared for such an offer, since a year ago I was told something else. So, I did not have the funds for the escrow, plus their time line was so short (5 days) to come up with it. Not very realistic. Plus, I had just made a full payment, so it would have been extra money on top of the payment I just gave them.

[determined1]

mar-no pay
apr-no pay
may-forebearance
jun-forebearance
july-forbearance
aug-no pay
sept-1st trial HAMP

[franklyspeaking]

They are doing the "trial plan" which is a forebearance for several months to see whose going to pay and whose not. it allows them to go later to the investor and show them you can do it. Its not that hard. A regular modification just brings you current and keeps your payment the same and they tack all your arrears and charges/fees into the loan again. You have to realize they are still trying to figure out everything. If you've seen the government guildelines its not that easy. Chase has never been anything but helpful to me, they just offered me the trial plan , what can it hurt to give them 3 payment to show good effort ? In a few months I think they will have the process a bit more downpact. Chase has an entire website dedicated to this https://www.chase.com/chf/mortgage/keeping-your-home with the correct phone# to call. they have put you with someone than handles your type loan (freddie,fannie,fha etc) . Also they have the in person centers now, has anyone having these issues tried to go there ?

[smit5454]

Here is my history

Feb 09 - Never Late (Called Chase indicating hardship and that I would have trouble making payments). Went to Chase Website, downloaded MM paperwork and faxed in all info.
March 09 - Called to follow up. Was told we would qualify for Obama plan. Went through financials, sent in additional requested info (they made us fax a notarized letter indicating we agree to go to HUD financial counseling)
April/May - Spent at least 100 hours of follow up calls, refaxing paperwork, asking where the "mysterious Fed-Ex packet" was. They literally promised me about 20 times I should have it any day. Finally I guess I badgered them enough and I received the trial mod.
May/June/July - Made 3 payments as requested via Western Union
August 5th - Called to get next steps after completing mod. Told I would receive permanent mod paperwork any day. Needed to fax in last 2 months of paystubs which I did.
End of August - Called to ask where permanent mod was, and what to do about payment. Told to make 4th payment, and if I did not receive permanent paperwork by 9-15 to call a certain number and a certain extension
9-15 - Called the number and extension, does not work or exist. Made about 20 calls trying to figure out who to call, ended up calling the same number and dept. I had been using all along. First person I talked too indicated they had not received ANYTHING form me since June. After arguing for about 10-15 minutes, I hung up on them. Called them back 5 minutes later. Talked to a different person. She pulled my records up, showed all my paperwork was good. Verified they had received the faxes of my income form 8-5 (which I did 3 times). She asked me why I faxed it 3 times with a laugh, and I indicated that all prior faxes I sent I was told were not received and I had to do all over again, so I have started doing it multiple times. She apologized for the prior person's incompetence, told me the name of my underwriter, said she would personally hand off my paperwork to her after she got off the phone, asked for my cell phone # and if it was okay for the underwriter to call me if necessary (I said YES), and said I should have something by Friday (tomorrow)

That being said, I will probably get a call or a letter saying "DENIED!" like everyone else. I have not seen ONE person get a permanent mod yet anywhere.

However, I am still in the game.

[marmor653]

Franklyspeaking, I have all the info. you posted and I have called the number on a regular basis.

Why are they Helping Some and Not Others. I have had absolutely no help from them, nor have I been offered this Trial Program. That's what I'm trying to figure out, by getting input here. It would appear so far, that only a very small precentage of people are receiving positive help from Chase. While the rest of us are just getting the shaft.

Is there some Secret Code that they measure us out with?

[smit5454]

Marmor,

Have you gone through the exact process (downloaded MHA paperwork from chase website, faxed in all information, etc.), or are you just calling them?

[marmor653]

smit5454, I've done all that. They have had my paperwork since 07/06/09. I call every few days, and always get told that I haven't been assigned to anyone. Originally was told would take 30days to get assigned, then it went up to 45days, then 60days. Now they tell me they don't know how long it will be.

[SwillerAlesbane]

I've saved four months of payments in my mattress!!! No NOD yet.

In the beginning I was excited to get a loan mod...now I'm quickly losing hope and wondering how long I'll be able to save for my impending departure.

Chin-up troops!!! Even if you lose your home, just save for 3 years and you are eligible for a 1st time buyers program through the FHA. (3% down whooo hooo, much better than the 20% I put down in the bubble...bye-bye $100,000 cash) In some aspects, it would be BETTER to get booted, and then just buy a new place after the toxic mess flows away.

I'm pissed and I don't use banks for jack sh!t now. I use a credit union for my bill payments, do not use credit cards, do not own a cell phone. It's really overdue time we get back to yankee frugality.

[determined1]

Frankly speaking Im glad your experience has been so positive. Per my conversation with Chase the trials are designed to rate the permanency of your hardship not to see who will pay or not. The fact is most of us on here have paid our forebearance plans and trials and are still not permanently modified. Chases focus has become finding reasons to deny people vs working to modify them. I work in lending and so I know personally it takes a lot more effort and time trying to find reasons to deny a loan then to approve it. Thats the reason why they are backlogged. If they finalized some people they wouldnt have stacks of files on their desks. I dont buy the still trying to figure it out story either. They have every resource and training support needed to be able to understand this HAMP program. I emailed the hmpadmin for servicers and they replied to my email in less than a minute to answer my question. None of us have that kind of support or resource.

Dont lose sight that this is a billion dollar institution and all of this is strategic and designed to mitigate their loss.

[famlena]

I was hopeful that maybe just maybe I would get some good news from Chase...I've read that someone on here was seriously being considered for the perm mod which gave me hope. Until I opened my mail Thursday. I was denied! "insufficient income" of course. I'm crushed and haven't been able to sleep.

After 5 months of trial payments I got the ax. I've been at this modification process over a year now. So, can't say that I didn't try to save my home...it's finally over...

I've been noticing there's a lot of Fed-Ex cars on the streets lately. I'm guessing they're delivering the HAMP packages. Chase will put people on the trials just to meet their numbers but that's as far as they'll go. In the meantime foreclosure proceedings continue even though it's suppose to be on hold while in mod process. That wasn't the case with me. NOD was filed while I made my 2nd trial payment. Another indication that I had been denied a long time ago but was just strung along.

I'd like to wish everyone good luck and hang in there but I just don't feel optimistic about it at all. Sorry, but Chase won't do much...in term of perm mods.

[marmor653]

This "insufficiant Income" I keep seeing, which is their bases for denial. Does anyone know the range of income, or the formula that they use to come up with it??????

What is considered passing income?????

[smit5454]

Your income needs to be the square root of (fiscal pay year X the day of the month there will be a full moon) divided by .298935783583583

If your income meets that then you will be approved.

[litehouse01]

We had missed 3 payments then we got the hamp trial modification plan getting ready to make our 3rd pyts on the trial on both the 1st and 2nd

[marmor653]

smit5454, I get it. Virtually Impossible. Goes back to that Secret Code thing.

So sad that we were lead to believe they actually wanted to help. What a joke.

Bottom line is: Their big business and Big Business never looks out for the little guy.

At least all this made me realize maybe it's time to start stock piling our money for the impending "Get Out Letter". And stop handing it to them.

[MAXIE19]

Originally Posted by marmor653

This "insufficiant Income" I keep seeing, which is their bases for denial. Does anyone know the range of income, or the formula that they use to come up with it??????

Originally Posted by marmor653

What is considered passing income?????

No one really knows since this information will vary from person to person and the lenders have not released their formulas, thus far. However, I think using the NPV test which has been posted and discussed on this forum on several occasions may be helpful. Although, the guidelines stipulate that the banks can reduce your interest rate to as low as 2%, this may not be realistic for many people unless you are going through NACA or the banks make a special exception for you. I think trying to get your numbers to work with no less than 3% is more realistic.

In my case, I am the only one on the loan and I initially applied for the mod using just my income and expenses as well as the amount of monthly contributions my husband makes to the household. I was summarily denied twice until I resubmitted using the entire household income (mine and his) as well as the entire household expenses. Using the entire household income increased our qualifying income by $1500.00. I still have not been approved but I have not been denied either and as of yesterday, was told that preliminarily, the new numbers work better and that our app was still under review. Our situation is further complicated by the size of our loan and also because we are both self-employed and therefore require greater scrutiny and levels of approval.

With my first two denials, I argued with my rep, that I believe that I qualified if offered a rate of 2.5%. I took my cue on what numbers to submit with my third submission when she emphatically responded by stating, "we are not offering anyone 2.5 %".

Prior to making my third submission, I compared my NPV results with my first two submissions with my NPV result from my third submission and noticed that I was under 3% with the first two, closer to 2.8 % and needed a term extension of about 35 years to qualify.

With the third submission however, the new numbers allowed me to qualify anywhere from 3% to 3.5% at around 30-32 years. I also enclosed my NPV results with the third submission.

My two cents about this process thus far based on my conversations with the supervisory rep, my personal circumstances and reading around the forum is as follows: You stand a better chance of being modified if your income is such that you can:

1. Achieve a PASS under the NPV test
2. With an interest rate of no less than 3 %
3. Require no principal forbearance to qualify
4. Have an equity in your home of no greater than 25% (of course the more underwater you are, the better for purposes of a loan mod).

Of course, having all these factors in your favor does not automatically mean that you will be modified. However, it may allow you to at least pass the numbers game, get a closer look and not be summarily kicked out the door. I am sure there may be some other variables that thus far have not come to my attention. I will modify my assessment when and if they do.

[jakelabry]

Originally Posted by marmor653

This "insufficiant Income" I keep seeing, which is their bases for denial. Does anyone know the range of income, or the formula that they use to come up with it??????

What is considered passing income?????

I would guess (only guess!) that they are saying income is insufficient to handle even a modified payment. In other word, 2% at 40 years with principal forbearance still isn't enough to make payment affordable or, modifying this loan is only delaying the inevitable because homeowner can't afford this house. I don't think there is a specific range or formula, just basic underwriting and underwriting loans is a very involved process.

[MAXIE19]

Originally Posted by jakelabry

I would guess (only guess!) that they are saying income is insufficient to handle even a modified payment. In other word, 2% at 40 years with principal forbearance still isn't enough to make payment affordable or, modifying this loan is only delaying the inevitable because homeowner can't afford this house. I don't think there is a specific range or formula, just basic underwriting and underwriting loans is a very involved process.

Jake:

See my posting above. A lot us will not have been denied for insufficient income if the banks were truly using 2% at 40 years. I believe the bar is a little bit higher than that despite the guidelines which explains why so many people are getting denied for that reason.

[marmor653]

Does anyone have a Link for this NPV Test????

Did a search on this site and all I'm finding is discussion of the NPV, but no actually place to be able to do the formula. Also did a Google search, Not seeing it.

[MAXIE19]

Marmor:

See below the link you requested as well as the information that you need to perform the test. Good luck.

FDIC: FDIC Loan Modification Program Guide – "Mod in a Box"



1. Original loan amount
2. Original amortization term
3. Original interest rate
4. Is your loan Interest only or Principal and interest
5. Current unpaid principal balance
6. Current interest rate
7. Remaining loan term
8. How many months past due
9. Monthly Income
10. Monthly taxes and insurance payment
11. Current value of home (try zillow.com, chase.com and cyberhomes.com for
home value estimates).