Delinquent hoa fees

[Tony12154]

My condo has been in foreclosure since May of this year. Although I have not
made any mortgage payments in a while, I have faithfully paid the $240/mo
HOA FEES. Now I find my savings growing very thin and have to decide whether to stop remitting this fee. My question is: If I do stop making these
payments, will I find myself in court at some future date having to make the payments PLUS penalties? I live in California..and as of now no SALE DATE has been set for my condo. Any advice or guidance you can offer would be appreciated.

[Paul Molinaro Esq.]

NO LEGAL ADVICE HERE - JUST GENERAL INFORMATION - ANY SIMILARITIES TO ANYONE'S ACTUAL SITUATION IS JUST ONE HECK OF A COINCIDENCE.

First HOA laws vary by state, some states allow HOA's to get downright ruthless in collections... and it might not be worth fighting them in these states. You'd want to check your state laws.

There is also the consideration of how ruthless your particular HOA will get... some of them hire a lawyer immediately and the legal fees pile up.

This is a question that is best answered by looking at your state laws AND your HOA's track record on collections.

- Paul

[Tony12154]

Thank you for the response. I see that you are in California. Actually not very far from where my condo is located.
So what if I just DONT have the money....you can't get get blood from a turnip as they say.....couldnt I just claim bankruptcy some where down the line?

[Tony12154]

As crazy as it sounds, I'd rather do jail time than pay another nickel to my HOA....and in California, they are letting" legitament" criminals free.....

[Irish Gal]

Originally Posted by Paul Molinaro Esq.

[B]This is a question that is best answered by looking at your state laws AND your HOA's track record on collections.
- Paul

Hey Paul,

How does one find out their HOA's track record re collections ? My experience is that the HOA mgr and power driven board members are very closed lip about everything, even minor things. They like to act like a secret society, so I stopped asking any questions about anything and try to avoid anyone assoc w/ the HOA at all costs. They treat homeowners in gen'l in an adversarial manner, even over minor disputes or if one questions anything the HOA does. So, how does one obtain accurate info on this issue, w/out getting vague answers or the brush off by a nitwit HOAer who might have that info ? I have a sense if I tried to find out how aggressive (or not) they are about collections, I might not get the true answer (as they'd want homeowners to "think" they are aggressive about collections, when may not actually be). Thanks!

[Irish Gal]

Originally Posted by Tony12154

As crazy as it sounds, I'd rather do jail time than pay another nickel to my HOA....and in California, they are letting" legitament" criminals free.....

Too funny, Tony! What I've read here is that the homeowner is responsible for any HOA dues until the foreclosure is complete. Once complete, you're off the hook. From what I've learned here, a condo owner is personally liable for the HOA dues until the foreclosure is a done deal. Allegedly, HOA's can, and often do, pursue delinquent owners in court post foreclosure. As you are only a few mos behind, if I were you, I'd communicate w/ the HOA and let them know of your situation and maybe set up a payment plan which will be cheaper than if they pursue you later via court (as they tack on late and atty fees, etc.). It's a personal decision really. I agree w/ you that HOAs stink. Many are really in the red now w/ the condo foreclosure mess, esp in CA. My dues were reasonable in 2005 when I bought but are now a complete rip-off 4 yrs later (almost doubled). It's a basic condo conversion, no fancy amenities. And the fees are through the roof. Part of it is for some stupid special assessment for some other unit that needed structural support, as it was on a hill and allegedly sinking (of course due to poor HOA mgmt yrs ago and delayed maintenance). I can't wait to get the f'k out !!!!!! I'd never buy into another condo again. HOA folks are a bunch of nitwits too Anyways, check out the Foreclosure thread that discusses HOA dues. Prof Shays usually tells folks to pay them (if you can) to avoid any suits post foreclosure from the nitwit HOAers. Good luck. Keep us posted!

[Hodgini66]

If you're already in default, why send them a dime?

IF a PERSONAL (unsecured by the condo) judgement post-foreclosure is obtained, they will have to come after you. Often times, they will settle for less depending on how collectible you are. Best to have an atty send an offer in compromise on your behalf though, easy to sh!t in your mess kit when dealing with collection agencies/creditors.

Sounds like you should just save your money. In the meantime, dig up that thick, old HOA "FEES AGREEMENT" states regarding remedies for collections in your spare time.

[Tony12154]

Thank you for responding sir.

[Tony12154]

Thanks "Irish Gal"....for your kind incite. Actually I'm not behind on my dues at all. I just hope CITIMORTGAGE sells this place quick ( yeah right)....These fees have been just such a waste and I agree that HOA people are just morons...I was hoping I could just bank this money for my uncertain future....

[Paul Molinaro Esq.]

NO LEGAL ADVICE HERE - JUST GENERAL INFORMATION - ANY SIMILARITIES TO ANYONE'S ACTUAL SITUATION IS JUST ONE HECK OF A COINCIDENCE.

Well, when I moved into a home with an HOA, I too was none too pleased with the way I was treated. Remembering what my mamma told me when I was a wee lad, "If you can't beat 'em, kill 'em" I then thought of what my papa said, "Son, your mamma's been carted off to the big house for murder." So I decided to join 'em instead. I became president of my home's HOA... and what an eye opener that was... it is a thankless volunteer job that gets all the homeowners to avoid you, unless they want a special favor.

Anyways, I digress... attend board meetings, join the board, talk to the board members... they are fellow homeowners, and are supposed to be just like you. If they are not, and act secretly, and so not answer questions, maybe get a group together and demand to know what's really going on.

- Paul

[sharona]

I spoke with one of the board members about paying HOAs and what happens if you don't, and he told me the banks have been paying them to lift the lein. I decided to stop paying them and take my chances.
I guess I could always try to settle with them later if it doesn't work out.

Sharona

[Liz Medrano]

Please someone,

What happens to delinquent HOA fees accumulated prior to a ch7 bk? Are they dissolved?

[Irish Gal]

Originally Posted by sharona

I spoke with one of the board members about paying HOAs and what happens if you don't, and he told me the banks have been paying them to lift the lein. I decided to stop paying them and take my chances.
I guess I could always try to settle with them later if it doesn't work out.

Sharona

Hey Sharona,

I learned that, too. Prof Shays also noted that unpaid dues can be negotiated in a short sale. There's a broker (here) who does shorts and she said that during a short offer, make sure your realtor lists the unpaid dues are on the HUD 1 so the lenders can take that amount into account when accepting any short offers. Her experience is that lenders are paying them (routinely). Hope all else is well !

[sharona]

Hey Irish Gal,

I hope all is well with you too! I am going to go throught the foreclosure versus short sale. I want this process over by the end of the year and don't want the drawn out process of a short sale. Plus the fact that I have a 80/20 loan and it is more difficult to get the second to settle with the first. It has been quite an ordeal getting through this process. Not sure who to believe or trust anymore but I'm getting through it.

How is everything with you?

Sharona

[Irish Gal]

Originally Posted by sharona

Hey Irish Gal,

I hope all is well with you too! I am going to go throught the foreclosure versus short sale. I want this process over by the end of the year and don't want the drawn out process of a short sale. Plus the fact that I have a 80/20 loan and it is more difficult to get the second to settle with the first. It has been quite an ordeal getting through this process. Not sure who to believe or trust anymore but I'm getting through it.

How is everything with you?

Sharona

Same ole, same ole here. I hear ya re foreclosure vs. short sale. Has your foreclosure process actually begun yet (NOD filed) ? Do you have a trustee sale date, yet? Are you just doing the waiting game til it's officially complete or is your 1st trying to get you to take a bogus mod and keeping your process in limbo? Whatever's occuring, hope it's going as you want .

[sharona]

Hey Irish Gal,

NOD was filed 7/30/09. No NOS yet. My lender seems to be on time so I expect the NOS to be the end of Nov. I will be moving out of state after the sale. California doesn't have the appeal for me it once had. I will miss San Diego though!
Where are you in the process?

Sharona

[Irish Gal]

Originally Posted by sharona

Hey Irish Gal,

NOD was filed 7/30/09. No NOS yet. My lender seems to be on time so I expect the NOS to be the end of Nov. I will be moving out of state after the sale. California doesn't have the appeal for me it once had. I will miss San Diego though!
Where are you in the process?

Sharona

I'm still going the short route, but like you, if not a go, I'm totally ok w/ foreclosing. Even though the lender knows that, they still encourage me for a bogus loan mod if/when I secure employment. They think I'm stupid . Yea, I want to be a forever renter while paying the property taxes and HOA dues for the landlord, too. I'm about $130k underwater and still sinking, now . I'm not emotionally attached to this place like many here. Just a box to me, now. And, because this whole mess has been soooo stressful and life changing, the place REALLY doesn't mean "home" to me. It represents nothing but a long-term, financial headache that needs to be gone so I can go back to living w/out thinking about some f'king cut throat banker and his crew. Day in and out. Plus, in my condo complex, many have foreclosed already and (more) low-end investors have snatched up cheap units and now rent to more wonderful, low-lifers. The ONLY way I'd work w/ the bank to keep this place is if they lowered prin to current value too or just GAVE me the place! That's it. By the way, what state are you moving to? I don't blame you one bit re CA. It's in deep doo-doo. You can tell Arnie can't wait to get back to Arnie-Wood. I never liked the guy, so not surprised he sucks. Have NO idea what Maria sees in that inarticulate dope. He was on t.v. the other day and actually said "Yesterday night" or something like that, when he meant "last night." Aaaaaahhhhhhh. But, I'm not a body builder chaser, so maybe I'm missing something . CA is not all HIS problem, but his solutions are the same ole, same ole, tired solutions that haven't solved anything to date. I get so tired of the inexperienced, millionaire class that get to "play" politician when they get bored just being millionaires so they then then can experiment w/ our lives. Another (billionaire) dope, Meg Whitman is gearing up to f'kkkk over average CAians when she gears up to run for Gov, soon. So, CA is in for a nice ride the next 5-10 yrs, this is true. The fires get old too. The constant worrying yr after yr, when will I have to evacuate too? I went through that the last big fire. AND, in 2003 too. Gets very old. The good thing is the pop is going down in CA, so over crowding is lessening. Illegals have gone home (no jobs). But, the powers that be need to do the legislative changes needed in CA or the state will just die, more. If that's possible! Oh, CA is not kind to business, either. They need to get their act together too in that arena. CA educ stats are lower than Mississippi now (worst state for educ levels). Bottom line, only vary wealthy CAians can enjoy what CA has to offer (weather; prime real estate; high end jobs and lifestyle). The rest struggle like paupers. Myself, I'm researching where to go next, too. I'd like to go out of country, really, until this Darth Vader period passes and America is on the upswing for average folk. No jobs here now but low end. It's bad everywhere. Wall St. really did a bang up job tanking the country and world econ. No? They should be proud of themselves, as they keep collecting their "talent" bonuses, while the gov't watches, passively. I'll stop now! Anyways, keep us posted. Be sure to post a "it's over" note and let us how your journey ended. Are you negotiating cash for keys? Be sure to let us know how generous your lender ends up being. Nice talking to ya!

[sharona]

Hey Irish Gal

I will keep everyone posted on my potential cash for keys deal. I am going to ask for 5k. I think that should cover my out of state moving costs. I will be moving to Austin Texas where the economy is good and unemployment is 7% there instead of 11.9% here in Ca. A few of my friends sold their homes here 4 years ago and bought new homes there for half the price. I should of moved with them then.

Take care,

Sharona

[Tony12154]

As of last Friday...my condo in Rancho Cucamonga,CA was auctioned off.
When I returned to my condo, I found that the LOCKS HAD BEEN CHANGED and a realtors lock box was on the door handle. Is this legal??
Can they just change the locks and throw us out !!! Well I called the number on the lockbox and was given the access code to get in. I have until NEXT Sat to get my possessions out. I am so ANGRY and confused.I thought there was aprocess whereby an evcition notice was served and we would be allotted time to vacate. Please ..anyone who can advise on this I am extremely grateful

******** in SoCal.

[Tony12154]

******** in SoCaL

[Paul Molinaro Esq.]

NO LEGAL ADVICE HERE - JUST GENERAL INFORMATION - ANY SIMILARITIES TO ANYONE'S ACTUAL SITUATION IS JUST ONE HECK OF A COINCIDENCE.

There are times when a property is deemed vacant (aka abandoned) by the lender allowing the lender to go in and secure the property by changing the locks.

- Paul